1181 Drivers Forum

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/18/nyregion/schools-reopen-nyc.html

Another article about delaying opening.

https://www.silive.com/coronavirus/2020/08/are-nyc-schools-ready-to-open-some-principals-pushing-for-a-delay.html

40,000 more have opted for 100% remote learning.

"Parents who want to opt out of that hybrid instruction model can do so at any time and their number is expected to rise in the coming weeks."

I think they're right about that.

https://nypost.com/2020/08/17/remote-only-school-requests-jump-by-40000-in-one-week/

From what I am reading Dumblasio is getting enormous pressure from many different outlets to delay in classroom learning. The DOE has seemingly failed to correct many existing problems that would in no way put us in compliance with any of the safety protocols needed to reopen. I truly do not understand how we are currently in no better shape to welcome the kids back to school then we were when they decided to close them. It appears nothing has been done to correct the ventilation problems nor have they done anything to disinfect the schools and classrooms themselves. The powers that be once again seem to be failing the children and the workers who so badly want and need to get back to work and to some sort of normalcy in our lives. Thanks once again Dumblasio for allowing your ego to prevent you from doing what is right for all of us.

if this doesnt happen on sept 10th... i think we will be looking at sept. 2021,and at that point we will probably have nothing left... hopefully we will have a vaccine in january,but the teachers will cry they scared to get the vaccine... UFT has an annoucement at 11AM today....we have to give UFT credit they fight and are strong,its  not good for us though..

Quote from: yabba on August 19, 2020, 03:12:06 PM
if this doesnt happen on sept 10th... i think we will be looking at sept. 2021,and at that point we will probably have nothing left... hopefully we will have a vaccine in january,but the teachers will cry they scared to get the vaccine... UFT has an annoucement at 11AM today....we have to give UFT credit they fight and are strong,its  not good for us though..

The vaccine theory makes no sense...all it will do is put people's minds at ease. We have flu and other virus vaccines and people still die and get sick from the flu sooooo what will this vaccine do? Lol people are gonna get sick just gotta deal with it without shutting everything down. Again it's easy for all of them to say close things down non of them had to deal with the stupidity of unemployment the last 6 months and look for benefits. It's like they are saying well we are protected eh school drivers screw them. It's pathetic because they don't know the struggle.

Quote from: yabba on August 19, 2020, 03:12:06 PM
if this doesnt happen on sept 10th... i think we will be looking at sept. 2021,and at that point we will probably have nothing left... hopefully we will have a vaccine in january,but the teachers will cry they scared to get the vaccine... UFT has an annoucement at 11AM today....we have to give UFT credit they fight and are strong,its  not good for us though..

And I'm sorry did people forget up until the last week we were driving packed buses to and from school, TO AND FROM school trips. Teachers taught in packed class rooms. All done with no masks or social distancing......people tend to forget

Quote from: WigWag16 on August 19, 2020, 04:06:59 PM

Quote from: yabba on August 19, 2020, 03:12:06 PM
if this doesnt happen on sept 10th... i think we will be looking at sept. 2021,and at that point we will probably have nothing left... hopefully we will have a vaccine in january,but the teachers will cry they scared to get the vaccine... UFT has an annoucement at 11AM today....we have to give UFT credit they fight and are strong,its  not good for us though..

And I'm sorry did people forget up until the last week we were driving packed buses to and from school, TO AND FROM school trips. Teachers taught in packed class rooms. All done with no masks or social distancing......people tend to forget

this is true... i dont know where all this will lead,i hope my feelings are wrong..

Yes we did drive packed school buses back and forth to school and on school trips up until the very last day. But does that mean we should have a blatant disregard for potentially human life ?  And before you answer that question take the time to think how you might feel should a rush to get the schools open unfortunately affect someone very close to you and your family. We would all love for the reopening of schools to go off without a hitch but I am pretty sure most of us know that's not a reality. Our Mayor and the BOE have unfortunately failed the students faculty bus drivers and everyone else involved in the everyday operations of schools once again. They have failed to meet most if any of the guidelines put in place to reopen the schools. Cuomo was smart he put the guidelines in place said ok and now has left it to Dumblasio to make the final decision. So that Cuomo assumes no risk this is ridiculous. We want to work and thanks to the inadequacies of the people in power unfortunately we may not be able. THIS ABSOLUTELY SUCKS !!!!

It's amazing that Pelosi called the House back in session to address the Post Office situation, but they all went on vacation without giving a shit about taking care of people without jobs.

Mail-in ballots are more important than people who are struggling, I guess.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 19, 2020, 02:03:04 PM
It appears nothing has been done to correct the ventilation problems nor have they done anything to disinfect the schools and classrooms themselves.

If anything in this video is true, it would seem to dispute what you're saying ... but who knows?





I don't understand about the ventilation. What schools have central air? They have windows ... just like the bus, but theirs are a lot bigger.

Looks good but is it just a publicity stunt put out there by Dumblasio ?  Listen I want to get back to work as much as the rest of us do but unfortunately we know all to well we can not trust either the Mayor or the BOE. I truly can not phantom what the hell they have been doing for the past 5 months. It's a total and utter disgrace.

Well it looks like the UFT is preparing not to go back on the 10th after their announcement just a short time ago. They want every child and adult to submit to a covid test and show proof of negativity before they can be permitted into the schools. Does that me we will all have to be tested as well ?  Their still complaining that schools have inadequate ventilation and they want all schools to be adequately equipped with PPE supplies. Along with a covid tracing team in place at every school. Seems like a lot to get accomplished in 22 days when they have gotten almost nothing accomplished since March. My wife works at CSI College and in a matter of 2 days they went from a mere 6 percent of the college returning for labs to no one returning at all because they are simply not ready. Can the school systems seriously be this poorly run.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 19, 2020, 07:18:59 PM
Well it looks like the UFT is preparing not to go back on the 10th after their announcement just a short time ago. They want every child and adult to submit to a covid test and show proof of negativity before they can be permitted into the schools. Does that me we will all have to be tested as well ?  Their still complaining that schools have inadequate ventilation and they want all schools to be adequately equipped with PPE supplies. Along with a covid tracing team in place at every school. Seems like a lot to get accomplished in 22 days when they have gotten almost nothing accomplished since March. My wife works at CSI College and in a matter of 2 days they went from a mere 6 percent of the college returning for labs to no one returning at all because they are simply not ready. Can the school systems seriously be this poorly run.

Listen if they want to delay the opening fine....THEN TAKE CARE OF THE SCHOOL BUS DRIVERS! Everyone working or involved some shape of form with the DOE, BOE is taken care of but us. Pay us our salary and benefits. We can't live off unemployment

WigWag16 I agree totally. I was only commenting on what I listened to, unfortunately we the bus drivers don't seem to be to high on their damn list of concerns. But if and when they do decide to open they will expect us to be ready. How can we possibly be ready if we have no idea what to plan for. What is so secretive that refuse to include the union and the owners in on their damn plans.

After watching the video, scroll down to see the UFT's School Safety Report. I don't believe the city has the money to implement many of these demands.

And I still don't understand how he thinks schools are safe for opening ... AND THEY MAY BE ... but at the same time doesn't think it's safe to open gyms, indoor dining, and malls. He's killing those businesses. They should sue the city.



https://www.fox5ny.com/news/teachers-union-sending-members-into-schools-to-check-safety-reopening-plans

Quote from: WigWag16 on August 19, 2020, 07:50:24 PM

Listen if they want to delay the opening fine....THEN TAKE CARE OF THE SCHOOL BUS DRIVERS! Everyone working or involved some shape of form with the DOE, BOE is taken care of but us. Pay us our salary and benefits. We can't live off unemployment

Agreed ... but we know damn well that the city doesn't give a shit about our financial or physical well-being. Any safety protocols that will be put in place for buses will be what they think is enough to satisfy parents that their kids are safe and any benefit to us will only be what happens to be incidental to that.

Buzz you are 1000 percent correct this is a giant cluster fuck. What did they do with the money given to them through the Cares Act or is it just not being funneled down to the schools. This is just more political bullshit that is designed to screw over the every day working class citizen. The demands are so high and so stringent that even if we had the money we just don't have the time to get it all done. We as bus drivers will be ready to the best of our ability but unfortunately the damn school system won't be.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 19, 2020, 06:57:06 PM
Looks good but is it just a publicity stunt put out there by Dumblasio ?  Listen I want to get back to work as much as the rest of us do but unfortunately we know all to well we can not trust either the Mayor or the BOE. I truly can not phantom what the hell they have been doing for the past 5 months. It's a total and utter disgrace.

You mean you don't trust our mayor?  ;D ;D ;D

About as far as I can throw a SCHOOL BUS !!!!

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 19, 2020, 08:10:43 PM
Buzz you are 1000 percent correct this is a giant cluster fuck. What did they do with the money given to them through the Cares Act or is it just not being funneled down to the schools. This is just more political bullshit that is designed to screw over the every day working class citizen. The demands are so high and so stringent that even if we had the money we just don't have the time to get it all done. We as bus drivers will be ready to the best of our ability but unfortunately the damn school system won't be.

the cares act seemed to be a joke and money not used where it was supposed to go...shocker...  we know the bus companies in NYC are being paid for under their contract at a reduced amount,which we got screwed and were easily laid off and benefits taken away...a lot of states been paying their school bus drivers,i did read i think seattle has finally laid off their school bus drivers recently... i wish we could have had a fight to try and at least keep our benefits...

Not exactly sure I would say The Cares Act was a joke it for Certain Kept Most of Us Afloat with the additional 600 to our unemployment. I will agree it was poorly managed and it's pretty evident that a lot of the funds are still left unused. The mis appropriation of funds and the inability to get anything done with money allocated well that's a whole different story. The bureaucratic bullshit is truly unbelievable, why can't everyone just agree to do what's best for us as a country and drop all political nonsense that seems to be making a bad situation worse. And now on top of that if the UFT and The Principals union get their way school will not start up. I read earlier that more than 1 out of every 10 principals is looking to submit medical documentation preventing them from returning to the schools but they want to continue to do it remotely. Must be nice to get paid in full including benefits and be able to stay home and do almost nothing.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 19, 2020, 10:39:28 PM
Not exactly sure I would say The Cares Act was a joke it for Certain Kept Most of Us Afloat with the additional 600 to our unemployment. I will agree it was poorly managed and it's pretty evident that a lot of the funds are still left unused. The mis appropriation of funds and the inability to get anything done with money allocated well that's a whole different story. The bureaucratic bullshit is truly unbelievable, why can't everyone just agree to do what's best for us as a country and drop all political nonsense that seems to be making a bad situation worse. And now on top of that if the UFT and The Principals union get their way school will not start up. I read earlier that more than 1 out of every 10 principals is looking to submit medical documentation preventing them from returning to the schools but they want to continue to do it remotely. Must be nice to get paid in full including benefits and be able to stay home and do almost nothing.

very true  the 600. was good but there was money allocated for school bus transportation thoughout the country...

There was money allocated for lots of stuff that was either never done or the money got diverted elsewhere. Our great Mayor saw our bus money as a means to offset a BOE deficiency as I recall. A way to offset an over 500 million dollar deficit. But even with doing that he still doesn't have the school system ready to open. I am not sure how or why money ear marked to keep intricate parts of the largest school system in the country afloat can be diverted so easily but yet it happened. Dumblasio continues to make a mockery out of our great city with every move he makes. He is a disgrace but unfortunately we are stuck with him for another 16 months. They can't go by fast enough.

Summer camps (indoor & outdoor) have been open throughout the city for 2 months. Some of these children are being transported to and from camp on school buses. Also these camps go on day trips where all the children from the camp are on the buses. I've literally seen (numerous times throughout the summer) Jewish camps with 5, 6 or 7 bus loads of children (up to 50 kids per bus) on the streets of Staten Island. And I'm sure the the other boroughs are just as crowded if not more. It makes no sense that the Mayor allowed this all summer yet two months later with the cases down and obviously more knowledge of the virus and how to contain it that he talks about getting rid of school busing because it's not safe. My opinion on this is because the summer camps are paid directly by the parents to whoever runs the camp and school busing is part of the NYC budget. I don't care what we've been told in the past about this Mayor and this virus. It's all about the money.

I wonder if they'd consider having everyone tested. 

I don't want to sound out of line, or against the union in anyway. But 1181 could dip a little into the strike fund and toss everybody a few hundred dollars, especially with a little help from the international. The strike fund isn't solely used during a strike, it's also used for organizing and other things. They also use it to pay members who assisted in organizing companies. I know a lot of matrons and drivers who have gone weeks without a dime expecting to feed their families, And I know they read this website. I mean come on, throw us a bone every once in a while we're dying here! I know there's a lot of money in that strike fund, it hasn't been used for seven years. These people are still getting the six-figure salary's and we are living on a few hundred dollars a week.

AMEN!

Everything everyone on this site posts is correct in individual arguments,but the problem is that has nothing to do with opening schools in September.From the top down all these bleeding heart liberals do not want Trump re-elected.Gov.Cuomo and Mayor DiBozo are wigged out socialist/communists.The NEA (National Education Asscociation),a far left money machine for the Dems,The teachers union are all in for removing Trump from office.November 4th this all goes away.

Quote from: LMR on August 20, 2020, 01:43:03 AM
Everything everyone on this site posts is correct in individual arguments,but the problem is that has nothing to do with opening schools in September.From the top down all these bleeding heart liberals do not want Trump re-elected.Gov.Cuomo and Mayor DiBozo are wigged out socialist/communists.The NEA (National Education Asscociation),a far left money machine for the Dems,The teachers union are all in for removing Trump from office.November 4th this all goes away.

I just hate how everyone in the school system is being taken care of pay and benefit wise from
Nurses, janitors, lunch lady's, teachers, principals  and we are left with scratch and deal with unemployment nonsense. We should be taken care of as well. If we go back on 9-10 and the teachers strike, we should be get paid from our company due to the fact we have a contract and our job is being affected by their walkout/strike

Are you sure strike fund money can be used for other things?

Well weve been getting the shaft since may 1st noone is honoring anything in our contract now without the stimulus I'm screwed we really got thrown under the bus pardon the play on words! :no:

Quote from: OMG on August 20, 2020, 01:20:33 AM
I don't want to sound out of line, or against the union in anyway. But 1181 could dip a little into the strike fund and toss everybody a few hundred dollars, especially with a little help from the international. The strike fund isn't solely used during a strike, it's also used for organizing and other things. They also use it to pay members who assisted in organizing companies. I know a lot of matrons and drivers who have gone weeks without a dime expecting to feed their families, And I know they read this website. I mean come on, throw us a bone every once in a while we're dying here! I know there's a lot of money in that strike fund, it hasn't been used for seven years. These people are still getting the six-figure salary's and we are living on a few hundred dollars a week.

Actually, Ernie tried to do this a couple of months ago, to try to keep our benefits going. He was told there are legal barriers that prevent the fund from being used for anything other than intended. (And yes, organizing is one of the things for which it was intended.) He tried.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on August 20, 2020, 02:32:15 AM
Are you sure strike fund money can be used for other things?

No, they cannot.

Many rules have been broken or over looked for emergency purposes since the pandemic, I.E., no pay, no opt-out, no accrual pay, etc. Michael's members are struggling and starving! Real leaders make tough decisions during hard times and it's not a time to be a damned coward, help your fucking members who pay your damn salary. Send out the checks so maybe we can order pizza while he eats steak. Don't fall for the bullshit, it can be done.

OMG does have a valid point. During this unprecedented pandemic especially for our nation many rules have be broken or changed throughout the country including government and private sectors. Two things that have changed is the extra 13 weeks unemployment and the DOE braking their contracts with the bus companies. Having said that even if the union could go into the strike fund I really don't know if the amount of money for each member would make a difference so it might be better off leaving it there for the future.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on August 20, 2020, 12:33:36 PM
OMG does have a valid point. During this unprecedented pandemic especially for our nation many rules have be broken or changed throughout the country including government and private sectors. Two things that have changed is the extra 13 weeks unemployment and the DOE braking their contracts with the bus companies. Having said that even if the union could go into the strike fund I really don't know if the amount of money for each member would make a difference so it might be better off leaving it there for the future.

The DOE did not break contract with companies.  They just talking over a new payment ... we were just the weakest link ( drivers and escorts). 

Yabba obviously it doesn't make a difference how we want to categorize what the DOE did with the contractors. In my opinion they definitely broke their contract they stopped paying the contractors in which the contractors stop paying us. They may be looking at a negotiating now on paying the contractors something toward the months that they already didn't pay but regardless they stop paying the contractors which means they broke the contract.

It just suxs.  We have no fight anymore.  We have Ernie and that's it.   Strength starts from the top.   International does nothing.  Shows no support.     Someone stated a few weeks back. 

I don't know if it's true or not that the international isn't showing any support but I do know that I asked and the international is still taking their monthly contributions from 1181 which I believe is in Excess of $100,000 per month! Which in my belief they should have waived since we first got laid off not just from a local but any local that is not working!

I'm not saying you wrong In what you were told.  But I. cant  possibly see our local having that much money to pay that at this point.

The school buses aren't the only industry contributing dues to 1181, there are other companies and transit also. But the school buses are pretty much their main source of revenue. Once again, I don't wanna sound like I'm anti-union in anyway, But Michael is sitting on a slush fund of cash that can be handed out to the members has a little bit of help. I don't want to hear about rules, fuck the rules! This is an emergency and his people who put money in his pocket every week are in trouble. I've been hearing nightmare stories from matrons especially on the brink of collapse,

Quote from: OMG on August 20, 2020, 08:26:09 PM
The school buses aren't the only industry contributing dues to 1181, there are other companies and transit also. But the school buses are pretty much their main source of revenue. Once again, I don't wanna sound like I'm anti-union in anyway, But Michael is sitting on a slush fund of cash that can be handed out to the members has a little bit of help. I don't want to hear about rules, fuck the rules! This is an emergency and his people who put money in his pocket every week are in trouble. I've been hearing nightmare stories from matrons especially on the brink of collapse,

i dont think that slush fund is as big as we may think..

On the contrary, I think there's more in there than you think. Regardless it belongs to the members, it's probably enough to throw each member a few hundred dollars or more.

Well after attending the refresher course this morning the light seems very dim at the end of the tunnel. As Owen so purposely put it neither The Mayors Office or The BOE has reached out to either Pioneer or 1181 and simply put we are running out of time. They have no idea what the safety protocols would be on the buses nor any clue what would be required of the drivers simply because they have yet to receive any guidance. The UFT is sitting back like fat cats saying they won't go back unless everything is exactly as they want it. Therefore complicating the situation even more. Dumblasio is going to wait until the end of the month to make a final decision and in the mean time we are just in limbo. This is a total farce and just a delay tactic until he is ready to face the music for all his mistakes in handling this situation. I truly don't know where we go from here but it doesn't look good.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on August 20, 2020, 09:40:39 PM
Well after attending the refresher course this morning the light seems very dim at the end of the tunnel. As Owen so purposely put it neither The Mayors Office or The BOE has reached out to either Pioneer or 1181 and simply put we are running out of time. They have no idea what the safety protocols would be on the buses nor any clue what would be required of the drivers simply because they have yet to receive any guidance. The UFT is sitting back like fat cats saying they won't go back unless everything is exactly as they want it. Therefore complicating the situation even more. Dumblasio is going to wait until the end of the month to make a final decision and in the mean time we are just in limbo. This is a total farce and just a delay tactic until he is ready to face the music for all his mistakes in handling this situation. I truly don't know where we go from here but it doesn't look good.

Again everyone in the school industry will be taken care of and we won't....that's nice just leave us with no benefits and a crappy unemployment system that pays ya crap. We should be getting our pay and benefits just like everyone else. This isn't our fault and we are suffering for it

Quote from: yabba on August 20, 2020, 01:15:17 PM
The DOE did not break contract with companies.  They just talking over a new payment ... we were just the weakest link ( drivers and escorts).

Have to disagree with you there, yabba. The city definitely did break the contract and I believe Carranza even acknowledged that in one interview.

Not here to defend the union one way or the other regarding the slush fund. Just wanted to let you know that Ernie did try very early on to use that money to help us and that's what he was told.

There little doubt in my mind that Ernie did try to use that fund to help us out. But that was very early on in the pandemic. But here we are entering the third week in August, with no opt out money, no accrual money, and living on basic New York on employment. That money could be given out to each member to help us out a little. I'm losing whatever faith I have in Michael. That strike fund money could be used to help out the members, even if it's only a few hundred dollars each, make a damn effort. Do something !

Quote from: Buzz on August 20, 2020, 11:58:11 PM

Quote from: yabba on August 20, 2020, 01:15:17 PM
The DOE did not break contract with companies.  They just talking over a new payment ... we were just the weakest link ( drivers and escorts).

Have to disagree with you there, yabba. The city definitely did break the contract and I believe Carranza even acknowledged that in one interview.

your right buzz...im just mean the bosses will be getting money and will survive very good...we are he ones who have no fight and got screwed...i think the little A$$hole said it while playing the guitar.... moron.. and i got nervous cause he was happy at the millions he was saving on the school buses... that why i think the plan is schools open with only special ed if they are required by law to provide buses...reg ed they going to bank the bucks to throw out the window somewhere else....  again i hope im wrong

Quote from: OMG on August 21, 2020, 12:10:31 AM
That strike fund money could be used to help out the members, even if it's only a few hundred dollars each, make a damn effort. Do something !

I'm trying to explain that it would be illegal for them to use that money arbitrarily, but I completely understand your frustration.

Let's see what happens the 28th with the accrual money arbitration ... if it doesn't get postponed.

Quote from: yabba on August 21, 2020, 12:31:03 AM

your right buzz...im just mean the bosses will be getting money and will survive very good...we are he ones who have no fight and got screwed...

If the contractors get money from the city then we have to get money ... accrual at the very least.

     My wife spoke to someone on her side of the family who has small children. They were just notified by the School/boe of the dates her child would be attending school under the blended learning plan. Unfortunately she didn't pay attention to the date but it was for PS 26 in Travis. I guess the teachers might not cooperate with that.

The Chancellor definitely acknowledged that the DOE broke the contract and because of that the contractors broke their contract with us. Both parties are using COVID-19 as the reason. So both parties have done something illegal. You know where I'm going with this?!?

Just saw a video on Facebook where Florida is starting their buses back up next week. Honestly we are so behind then 8 ball on this it a joke. It's basically what we were doing prior to the shut down with cleaning the bus, wearing a mask and each kid has their own assigned seat for each grade with their name above them as well as wearing masks.

https://www.facebook.com/103702517668464/posts/326216265417087/?vh=e&extid=ilOpOK1BGKcji4fR

If we had Florida's numbers I am not sure I would be rushing back to work anyway. Listen I truly am not sure what is going on anymore here in NYC and I really don't give a shit what other cities and states are choosing to do. I just wish Dumblasio and the BOE would make a definitive decision and give us the Bus Drivers a chance to be ready for Sept.10th if that is going to be the day. As it stands now with every passing day our chances look more and more bleak. I think they are being very unfair to the parents students and US if they wait till the end of the month. We need a chance to do whatever it is they will finally decide upon so we can simply just do our jobs. Enough bullshit just make a fucking decision already.

Cuomo didn't exactly give a vote of confidence about sending kids back to school ...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8651983/Cuomo-suggests-hes-not-sure-hed-send-kids-school.html

Unfortunately it doesn't seem anyone is giving the return to in person schooling a positive vote. What I don't understand is the absolute disregard for all of us involved. Do they really not understand what is at stake here. For many of the drivers and matrons this is far more serious than those assholes realize. Listen if going back is not the answer than be honest and tell us that. But also have something in place to help those that are going to need help. Far to many are potentially going to loose everything they have worked so hard to be able to have. The honest truth is we need some kind of stimulus package, I know most if not all of us would rather return to work and earn what it is we are entitled to. But if that is not a possibility get off your lazy asses and do something to help the people that need it to get through this. We are working class people and if the fucking politicians are honest it's the working class people that make this world go round. So for once support us and help us continue to live the lives we have chosen. Stop being so ignorant and show some sympathy for the working class. We did not choose to be in this situation but unfortunately we are think outside the box for once.