1181 Updates 5/29

[Buzz]

https://atu1181.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/UPDATE-TO-MEMBERSHIP-5.29.2020.pdf

https://atu1181.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Testimony-Michael-Cordiello-5-21-2020-MC-.pdf

https://atu1181.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/School-Bus-Industry-Letter-Senators-Schumer-Gillibrand-5192020.pdf

https://atu1181.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/SI-Pioneer-Story-05.27.2020-.pdf

[hideout]

     Any word on June accrual checks from the union?

[PROUD MEMBER]

I won't bank on it.

[hideout]

    What about pro rating the accrual checks for that portion of the year that we worked?

[Buzz]

As far as I know we're supposed to get the whole thing. I'll remain optimistic that Neil is going to do the right thing here, but if not, as with Reliant, we know the union will go to arbitration over it. (And win.)

[PROUD MEMBER]

We were also supposed to get paid for May & June as per our contract which has nothing to do with Neil's contract with the City but we aren't. It's always good be be optimistic but let's face reality. I hope I'm wrong. Just so everyone understands and doesn't misinterpret me, I'm not blaming our reps. They can only ask and fight for OUR money but they can't take it out of Pioneer's bank account. As far as Arbitration goes I'd assume that besides the accrual checks that we're also going to ask for May & June (at 85%). And due to this pandemic and uncertain times the chances of us being awarded a win in arbitration is also scary.

[LMR]

You're pretty much calling it right Proud Member.The one thing I believe we are entitled to is at least 80% of the accrual money because we only lost May and June which is 2 out of the 10 months of the full year.This remains to be seen.Staying positive

[Eucerin]

Typically when is the Accrual check paid?

[PROUD MEMBER]

It's usually around two weeks before the last day of school. So this year it should be June 12th.

[Eucerin]

thanks from your mouth to God's ear's

[Buzz]

We were also supposed to get paid for May & June as per our contract which has nothing to do with Neil's contract with the City but we aren't ... As far as Arbitration goes I'd assume that besides the accrual checks that we're also going to ask for May & June (at 85%).

But after getting unemployment during that time, that could be a problem.

[Buzz]

It's usually around two weeks before the last day of school. So this year it should be June 12th.

Yes, I believe by contract it has to be paid by the 15th, but they usually pay the preceding Friday.

[wheresmymoney!]

Should get accrual checks prorated. Hopefully theyll give us accrual for the time we've  worked at least. Right thing to do bcz we already earned that money.

[Buzz]

Should get accrual checks prorated. Hopefully theyll give us accrual for the time we've  worked at least. Right thing to do bcz we already earned that money.

Should get 100% accrual money ... just like Easter.

[wheresmymoney!]

Agreed!

[Buzz]

Quoting from the contract:

"Pro-rata wage accruals shall be granted to employees terminated whether by discharge, lay-off or quit. The amount of such wage accrual shall be computed pro-rata since the last wage accrual period and such amount shall be paid within one week after termination."

So, computing from last accrual period ... June 15 of last year ... to April of this year, we should get at least 10/12 of the amount due.

And, it should have been paid a month ago.

However, the lines are blurred between "lay-off" and "furlough." I have not found any legal distinction between the two, but most sites I visited mentioned that "furlough" implies that employee benefits remain intact ... clearly not the case here.

On a brighter note, top-pay employees will be getting a 2.35% wage increase as of July 1 ... not that it means much when you're not getting paid.

[wheresmymoney!]

so Buzz what does this mean? its seems like we should be getting the pro rated amount then? or is there some discrepancy because they used the word furlough instead of layoff - even though its actually a layoff since we lost our benefits.

[Buzz]

so Buzz what does this mean? its seems like we should be getting the pro rated amount then? or is there some discrepancy because they used the word furlough instead of layoff - even though its actually a layoff since we lost our benefits.

It means we should at least get 10/12ths (83.3%). Whether we do or not remains to be seen.

[Hammer2161]

I agree with Buzz on this one as far as the accrual checks and opt out money go I will remain optimistic as it appears Neil is trying to do the right thing. As far as our salaries for May and June that unfortunately at this time is water under the bridge. It is way to complicated and we would be required by law to pay back every penny we received from unemployment. Stay safe everyone and let's hope for the best.

[PROUD MEMBER]

I don't see the complication. We go to arbitration and win and get paid and then pay back unemployment. The complication will come if we don't get paid for the time we're furloughed and when it's time to retire and you THINK you have 20 years in and say you missed between two and four months and the Union tells you that you have to put in another ENTIRE year in order to receive a twenty year pension.

[04012013]

I don't see the complication. We go to arbitration and win and get paid and then pay back unemployment. The complication will come if we don't get paid for the time we're furloughed and when it's time to retire and you THINK you have 20 years in and say you missed between two and four months and the Union tells you that you have to put in another ENTIRE year in order to receive a twenty year pension.

Just retire when you're ready. The difference in pension amount from 19 to 20 yrs (or any other single year) is not worth stressing the furlough over. And it's surely not worth working an ENTIRE extra year for!

[Buzz]

I don't see the complication. We go to arbitration and win and get paid and then pay back unemployment. The complication will come if we don't get paid for the time we're furloughed and when it's time to retire and you THINK you have 20 years in and say you missed between two and four months and the Union tells you that you have to put in another ENTIRE year in order to receive a twenty year pension.

No. We worked enough this year for this to count as a full year.

If it goes on past September, that's something else.

[PROUD MEMBER]

I should have clarified. I was speaking about going past September but now that you make the point about May & June although I agree with you maybe we should check into that. This is not an individual or a few individuals that missed May & June. And correct me if I'm wrong when it comes time for those individuals to retire the Union will tell them they owe x-amount of dollars. In this case 6000 members & the contractors haven't contributed for a full two months. Does it make a difference I don't know but stranger things have happened. With regards to the difference in pension from 19 to 20 years it's about $900 a year. To some it's nothing, to others it's the world!

[Buzz]

I don't think any money would be due for May and June towards the pension. If somebody, for example, had retired on April 1st, they would have had 1,000 hours in, and this year would have counted and they wouldn't owe any money.

I'm not sure by what date in March we reach 1,000 hours.

[Hammer2161]

I am sorry you are unable to see the complicated part of having to pay back the money to unemployment. But believe me it will be. For most who have been forced into this unfortunate situation the money they have been receiving is more then they would have cleared while working. So even if the city decides to pay us, the amount will not cover or be equal to what you have collected. They will want the entire $504 plus the entire $600 for every week you collected. I truly doubt that many if any of us were able to put that extra 600 in an envelope just in case we have to pay it back in case we get paid. They very same people who see that extra $900 a year between 19 years of service and 20 years as the world would be severely hindered by having to pay back all that money. I understand all of the frustration regarding the Doe's unwillingness to pay out the contract for May and June but at this point for many it would be better off financially playing out the way it is.

[Buzz]

Or ... best case scenario ... we keep both. If we got the back pay, once we go back to work, it could be paid as 40 hours overtime for 8 weeks. Unemployment problem solved.

[wheresmymoney!]

I really think we should get our accrual checks bcz its money we've already earned.  We lost our benefits got paid unemolyment the benifets are costing alot for some of us and the checks are going to help us all im sure!

[Hammer2161]

@Buzz Have to appreciate a man who is always thinking lol

[PROUD MEMBER]

Obviously financially it is better to keep it the way it is. I'm just shooting out scenarios and passing the time. And I would ASSUME the Union has or will request for May & June and every other month that the schools are closed. It's their responsibility whether or not we collected unemployment. Let's not forget the extra $600 ends July 31st and also if we don't go back to work until January that unemployment benefits will already have ended for some of us. Lastly with regards to paying back unemployment there are some Pioneer Employees that are already paying back. Our last day of work was March 13 but we got paid (85%) until April 30th. These employees collected unemployment during that time (7 weeks) and it caught up to them. It's not that complicated they are now paying it back.

[Buzz]

Lastly with regards to paying back unemployment there are some Pioneer Employees that are already paying back. Our last day of work was March 13 but we got paid (85%) until April 30th. These employees collected unemployment during that time (7 weeks) and it caught up to them. It's not that complicated they are now paying it back.

Well, that wasn't too bright of them.

I'm sure you know the state's UI benefits have been extended to 39 weeks.

There is a slim chance the the federal money could be extended, possibly at a reduced rate.

I hear people  ... politicians, radio personalities ... say that some people are making more, (with the $600), then they do when they're working so why would they go back? This is bullshit. If you're called back to work and refuse you are no longer entitled to UI benefits so they should stop the bullsht.

[Hammer2161]

I apologize if if you think I am looking for an argument because I assure you I am definitely not. But what I am saying is I am pretty sure most people are taking advantage of the extra money coming in from both the UI benefits and the extra 600. I can surely appreciate the union going after any money owed us from the DOE but there can possibly be ramifications. And as for the people who tried to take advantage of a bad situation and claim UI benefits they were not entitled to so they could also get the additional 600 to bad for them. Either way I hope somehow it works out in our favor but unfortunately we all no that won't happen. Good luck everyone.

[faceit]

Heard from a friend who's wife works at Island charter apparently they are not getting the accrual money

[Buzz]

Heard from a friend who's wife works at Island charter apparently they are not getting the accrual money

Hmm ... that doesn't bode well for us.

[hideout]

     Anyone know, as per our contract language, how us being on furlough effects our accrual payment?

[Buzz]

     Anyone know, as per our contract language, how us being on furlough effects our accrual payment?

No ... nobody envisioned this scenario specifically for them to be mentioned together, but we are definitely due the accrual. Whether we get it or not remains to be seen.

[faceit]

There is no reason  whatsoever why we shouldn't get our accrual checks.

[PROUD MEMBER]

Hate to be negative but one reason that Neil might use is that he paid us and also paid into our pension and welfare fund for the month of April even though the DOE didn't pay him. I'm not saying that that should have anything to do with it. But he can turn around and say that we're looking for accrual checks and he already paid all of us 4 weeks pay that he shouldn't have. The bottom line we'll know by June 15th at the latest. If we don't get it then our Reps will do what they have to do. I hope I'm wrong but if we are going to get the accrual I'd assume we would have heard by now.

[faceit]

That has nothing to do with the accrual money he WILL get paid by the city they have a contract as we do for our accrual money

[PROUD MEMBER]

I said it has nothing to do with it. We also have a contract that says we should get 85% for May & June but we aren't getting paid.

[hognol]

That has nothing to do with the accrual money he WILL get paid by the city they have a contract as we do for our accrual money

Not so sure about that. The city is not honoring their contracts. Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is no "force majure" in the city's contract with Pioneer. Bus companies in NJ are still being paid with benefits. Litigation must start but that takes plenty of time.

[wheresmymoney!]

Weve already earned the pro rated accrual money thats our money....we should be getting it theres no excuse why we wouldnt get it bcz pioneer should already have that money...correct me if im wrong on that point.

[Hammer2161]

I do agree that our accrual money and opt out money should have already been placed aside since September but I will share this that was told to me from outside the company. Pioneer along with several other companies has not received payment from the DOE since the middle of March. Which means Neil paid out 6 weeks of salary medical benefits and whatever else it is that makes this company run. You do not need to be a mathematician to realize he is probably out well over 10 million dollars as we speak. Not looking to argue just putting out the facts as I know them.