1181 Drivers Forum

Need to ask, what are the chances that we will be Furloughed again? Did we get any protection with our contract? If so when?

The chances are good we will be laid off if not working the week after next but that is yet to be determined. Le't get past next week first.

thanks trying to get my ducks in a row

Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

How do you justify driver # 350 work and make 100% of salary and driver #10 who wants to work sit home at 85% salary... it's all about union seniority

Quote from: faceit on November 20, 2020, 04:45:10 PM

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

How do you justify driver # 350 work and make 100% of salary and driver #10 who wants to work sit home at 85% salary... it's all about union seniority

How do you justify driver # 350 work and make 100% of salary and driver #10 who wants to work sit home at 85% salary... it's all about union seniority

The guy making 85 percent is making top salary I don't think their pockets are gonna hurt missing the extra 15 percent to a guy getting sent to unemployment making nothing and likely not getting the 85 percent. That's how I justify it

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:54:39 PM

Quote from: faceit on November 20, 2020, 04:45:10 PM

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

How do you justify driver # 350 work and make 100% of salary and driver #10 who wants to work sit home at 85% salary... it's all about union seniority

then maybe you should work for a non-union company this is what we pay dues for it's all about seniority.. I understand where you are coming from it's unfortunate times for us all hope it gets better soon.. every penny counts for us all at this time....

How do you justify driver # 350 work and make 100% of salary and driver #10 who wants to work sit home at 85% salary... it's all about union seniority

The guy making 85 percent is making top salary I don't think their pockets are gonna hurt missing the extra 15 percent to a guy getting sent to unemployment making nothing and likely not getting the 85 percent. That's how I justify it

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

It's a union shop, bro. It's all about seniority.  But we all started out at the bottom and I can tell you first hand ... shit DOES run downhill. Sorry, but we've all been where you are and that's just the way it works.

Quote from: Buzz on November 20, 2020, 05:00:46 PM

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

It's a union shop, bro. It's all about seniority. That's the way it works. But we all started out at the bottom and I can tell you first hand ... shit DOES run downhill.

So
This is a fact if number 8 isn't working he can pick off number 350 due to his school being closed

worst case scenario if we get furlough, don't we all go to unemployment?

Quote from: Eucerin on November 20, 2020, 05:05:28 PM
worst case scenario if we get furlough, don't we all go to unemployment?

Of course.

It is best we all get furloughed before this dividing maneuvering takes place.

Quote from: 04012013 on November 20, 2020, 05:08:46 PM
It is best we all get furloughed before this dividing maneuvering takes place.

All going back to work would be even better.

But would you be making any less being on unemployment even if others were working than you would if everybody was on unemployment?

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 05:03:31 PM

Quote from: Buzz on November 20, 2020, 05:00:46 PM

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 20, 2020, 04:39:31 PM
Lemme get this straight. If older guys schools are closed for a while they can pick off guys runs who are working? I was under the impression as long as your school is open and you want to work it's your run, they can't pick it off.

It's a union shop, bro. It's all about seniority. That's the way it works. But we all started out at the bottom and I can tell you first hand ... shit DOES run downhill.

So
This is a fact if number 8 isn't working he can pick off number 350 due to his school being closed

yes that's what seniority is all about

So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID !  so your stuck on the run from last year , I Didn't hear to may senior people complaining about it then . So people who were looking to switch runs are shit out of luck and the non public school drivers who came in well past everyone else regardless of seniority were stuck . But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so there is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 03:25:34 AM
So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID !  so your stuck on the run from last year , I Didn't hear to may senior people complaining about it then . So people who were looking to switch run where shit out of luck and the non public school drivers who came in well past everyone else regardless of seniority were stuck . But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so their is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

PREACH LMAO 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 03:25:34 AM
So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID !  so your stuck on the run from last year , I Didn't hear to may senior people complaining about it then . So people who were looking to switch run where shit out of luck and the non public school drivers who came in well past everyone else regardless of seniority were stuck . But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so their is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

I agree 100 percent with this. I don't want to hear well "we pay dues and this is a union thing" that makes 0 sense because at the end of the day guess what? I'm paying dues into the union too soooo I'm Basically paying dues for someone to steal my run because my run has a school that's currently open? It's unfair and makes 0 sense. I can understand if someone says you know what I don't want to work. They go to the list and they go from top to bottom who wants to work, not well this guys school is closed I'm gonna pick his run....for what an extra 15 percent compared to a guy who is going to get sent to the unemployment line and make crap.  85 percent of top pay to sit home is pretty good to me compared to new guys or middle numbered guys that need the 100 percent more in my opinion. It's gonna be what it's gonna be but it's not fair at all for example number 78 to take number 250 or 350 run because they have a Jewish or catholic school open at the time. And again why am I paying dues if this happens and my run gets taken from me. How does that help me? It doesn't.  I'm all about putting time in and earning your spot but not during this time of life. That's not how you take care of people. You don't reward others by punishing others especially during this time. That's all I'll say on this

Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about. 

I haven't heard anything definitively from the Union or Pioneer (the company that signs our checks) with regards to November 30th and after. Will the private schools still get service and which drivers will work is a good question. I understand seniority but My Opinion is if the private schools still get bus service than whoever's run it is should work AS LONG AS the employees that do not work get 85% pay.
IF it is people who work get 100% pay and those that don't work get unemployment than I believe you would have to go by seniority.
Obviously the best scenario as far as less separation between drivers would be that just like for the month of April, no buses roll and we ALL keep our benefits and get 85%. But having said that depending on how long public schools are closed in the long run it might be better for the industry and us if private schools still get bus service.
Hopefully all schools will reopen November 30th. Unfortunately and I hope I'm wrong my personal opinion is if public schools do not reopen November 30th that all bus service will stop even if the private schools remain open (which they may not). At that point we'll all be furloughed (unemployed) again but this time I believe we'll keep our medical benefits. The Medical Benefits is the biggest concern for the overwhelming majority of us throughout the industry including us at Pioneer!!!
Go Bless Everyone

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 03:25:34 AM
So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID ! ... But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so there is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

Man, you love to stir the shit ... and you're the best! That's why you're the King of All Shit Stirrers!  ;D ;D ;D

First of all, there IS NO PICK now. Those senior men who want to work will be HANDED A RUN ... take it or leave it. And after they've exhausted the runs that aren't currently covered by a permanent driver they will assign the non-public school runs of the  lowest drivers in seniority.

Do you know what that means? Jewish schools ... probably won't get in until 5:30, maybe later. But to answer your question, when schools re-open, everybody will go back to the runs they had before schools closed.

I disagree that senior men don't want a pick. Some would love to get some of those sweet trip runs ... being there are no trips now.

Some years ago we lost a bunch of runs in the fall. About 15 people were laid off, or some were offered to work in the Bronx. Many of the runs that were cut were senior man runs. Do you think they were laid off? Of course not ... guys at the bottom of the list were, even though their runs weren't affected. It's all about seniority.

It's like that in any union industry ... those with more seniority get to work before those with less. I don't see how guys didn't understand this when they started this job. It's what they signed on for ... but now they want to complain about it.

I know some do so because they desperately need the money, and I sympathize with them, but that's the harsh reality of a union structure and it was their choice to be a part of it.

On the other hand, some people just complain because they love to STIR THE SHIT!!!  :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Quote from: yabba on November 21, 2020, 08:08:49 AM
Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about.

Highly unlikely. It's going to be unemployment, most likely. If it were 85%, I think most senior drivers would stay home rather than work for 15%.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 21, 2020, 11:29:49 AM
I haven't heard anything definitively from the Union or Pioneer (the company that signs our checks) with regards to November 30th and after. Will the private schools still get service and which drivers will work is a good question.

Maybe I misunderstand the question, but if non-public schools are still open come the 30th, the senior drivers who told Andy they want to work will be doing those runs ... it's for that week that he was asking people with the assumption (at this point) that it will be a choice between working or unemployment.

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 21, 2020, 04:33:50 AM
....for what an extra 15 percent compared to a guy who is going to get sent to the unemployment line and make crap.  85 percent of top pay to sit home is pretty good to me compared to new guys or middle numbered guys that need the 100 percent more in my opinion.

I'm pretty sure the 85% will only be for next week and as I understand the way Andy's doing it, everybody will be on their own runs for Thanksgiving week. The week of the 30th it will most likely be a choice of working for 100% or getting unemployment. Nonetheless, I know a number of senior men, (including myself), who declined to work and go on unemployment, meaning those who need it more will work. Don't paint all senior guys with one brush.

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 21, 2020, 04:33:50 AM
I'm all about putting time in and earning your spot but not during this time of life. That's not how you take care of people. You don't reward others by punishing others especially during this time. That's all I'll say on this

If not "during this time of life" then when? A guy with one year on the job should earn before a guy with 25 years? Is that what you're saying? It's when the shit hits the fan that seniority counts the most and it IS how you take care of those people ... and they all earned their spot over many years.

I know there are people who are in much more dire need than others and I honestly sympathize with them. But this is how it works in a union shop and if they didn't understand that coming in and can't accept it now, they might want to consider a career change because it's going to be a lot of years before they realize the benefit of seniority when it really matters.

Quote from: Buzz on November 21, 2020, 11:52:44 AM

Quote from: yabba on November 21, 2020, 08:08:49 AM
Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about.

Highly unlikely. It's going to be unemployment, most likely. If it were 85%, I think most senior drivers would stay home rather than work for 15%.

i agree buzz and the reality is its going to be Unemployment..  this is all inline to what the NY Post reported over a month ago... after 5 days of school closing ,contractors would go to 43%....

From reading different posts here I'm a little confused also. My take from what Andy & Anthony were asking yesterday morning was

1. Do you currently have a private school on ur run.

If u said yes than u were told u have to do that run.

If u said no than u were asked if u would want to cover an OPEN private school run if available and ur name would be put on a list and u would be HANDED a run in seniority order and after seniority if there are still open runs left you would be handed a run from the bottom of seniority up.

Also I was under the impression that they were only talking about Monday, Tuesday & Wednesday of this upcoming week. I didn't think but then again I didn't ask if they were talking about November 30th and after.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 21, 2020, 12:31:10 PM
From reading different posts here I'm a little confused also. My take from what Andy & Anthony were asking yesterday morning was

1. Do you currently have a private school on ur run.

If u said yes than u were told u have to do that run.

If u said no than u were asked if u would want to cover an OPEN private school run if available and ur name would be put on a list and u would be HANDED a run in seniority order and after seniority if there are still open runs left you would be handed a run from the bottom of seniority up.

Also I was under the impression that they were only talking about Monday, Tuesday & Wednesday of this upcoming week. I didn't think but then again I didn't ask if they were talking about November 30th and after.

Originally, Ernie said the "bumping" would start next week. Andy, however, was lining up people to work for the week beginning the 30th. It was just too short notice for him to get a list together and assign runs to take effect this Monday so, as I understand it, everybody who has a non-public school run will do those runs Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. I will double-check with him later to make sure I understand it correctly.

(There were probably not many senior drivers who would have wanted to work for 15% for those 3 days anyway.)

Damn buzz (aka double agent man )come up for air or rest those chubby little  fingers  ! Listen you pick and Sign for your run your name goes with that run ,if there's no pick you stay with that run good or bad ,he'll I hate coming in  late I was told no pick this year I'm stuck and have to deal with it  but now we pick and choose when seniority comes into play , can I than take a junior person afternoon because I don't like mine  ? The answer is NO ! But I'm senior !  If it gets that bad than we throw out the current pick let seniority rule and when school going to return we have a new pick for everyone .
Picks = seniority
Charters Runs = seniority
O/T Coverage = seniority
Your assigned run shuts down = stay home

Well for several reasons I believe we are putting the cart before the horse,
1- This will only come into play if Cuomo doesn't deem all of NYC an Orange Zone which pretty much seems inevitable with the positivity rates being what they are.
2- Potentially Staten Island could become an Orange Zone all on its own since our positivity rate has been well over 4 percent for 11 straight days now.
3- Also as of Friday from what I was told there are 20 or more runs that are not currently covered by a permanent driver that would come into play first.

Now here is where it will get good after those 20 or more runs are given out they will start from the bottom up with runs that have work on the 30th and offer them to the senior drivers who are still looking to work. I for one do not see many of the senior drivers who are looking to work doing so if it means they will be getting in after 5 pm or possibly later than that.
What has to happen at that point is once you are offered a run and you say no, you need to be removed from the list and forfeit you chance at working.
I know this isn't a what a lot of people want to hear but WE ARE A UNION SHOP. And simply put because of that if people have to be furloughed and put on unemployment it has to be the people with less seniority unless people volunteer.
For a lot of reasons I know this will be troubling for many if not all of us. But please try to remember we all took a union job and therefore union rules have to apply.

MY FELLOW BROTHERS AND SISTERS IT IS THANKSGIVING WEEK AND HARD AS THIS MAY BE TO HEAR PLEASE TRY TO BE THANKFUL FOR WHATEVER IT IS THAT IS POSITIVE IN YOUR LIFE.
UNFORTUNATELY FOR A LOT OF US THAT WILL NOT BE SO SIMPLE THIS COMING HOLIDAY SEASON AND I ASK THAT WE ALL KEEP THOSE PEOPLE IN OUR PRAYERS.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍽🍁 TO EVERYONE AND MAY GOD WATCH OVER ALL OF US AND HELP TO SEE ALL OF US THROUGH THESE TROUBLING TIMES. GOOD BLESS !!!!

Sooooo as I stated.....why bother to pay union dues as a junior man if you're here one year if basically after thanksgiving I'm paying the union to screw myself over to lose my run. You can't compare this situation to another situation when it comes to seniority because this is a situation of its own. And let me be clear I'm not saying I don't respect anyone that's here 20 plus years that's not the case, my father is a retired driver I have all the respect in the world for senior drivers BUT as I said how does this situation help me. I'm paying the union to help me and look out for me by having my run taken from me. It's not fair, it's not right, it's total bs and this just doesn't affect junior men this could affect senior men too taking another senior mans run. I'm sorry but I'm firm with if your school is closed you don't work if your school is open on your run you work. That's the whole purpose picking runs. You guys stayed away from Catholic and Jewish because they come in late but now because some drivers are lucky to still have those schools open to work you wanna bump them off. What's next on a regular
day when the public schools are closed you wanna bump a guy off because you want a days pay when Jewish and Catholic is open? It's not right and this situation has nothing to do with seniority I don't care how you try and spin it. They should ask all the drivers who's schools are closed if they want to work then they would be called in seniority order if a current open school driver doesn't want to go into work.

Your run you work.....

This also has nothing to do with stirring the pot, or disrespecting anyone. I'm an employee with an opinion doesn't matter how many years you're here.

LMAO - WigWag16 - I would consider myself a Senior man. I have a school that will be open, and most likely will be able to work at 100% salary doing my run that I picked After Nov.30. So any changes really does not affect me, unless I choose NOT to work and go on unemployment, as Buzz intends to do.

Now how can you justify that "IF" I didn't have a school open with my Seniority and Furloughed (unemployment) , that a Junior man is working and earning a Full salary (no matter what his pay scale is). Do you think that's right?

Let me tell you something you probably don't know. When I started my run was 3 schools in the AM and 4 schools in the PM with TRIPS! Trips were everyday, 5 days a week and if you were lucky you got maybe 1 or 2 days a month you didn't get a trip!!! That's a FACT and the Truth!!! That changed when Eddie became our shop steward and made most new runs trip runs. That's one of the reasons why you don't get trips everyday and when senior men retired they made those runs trip runs. That's why there are Nice trip runs and you DON'T do trips everyday, because there are more trip runs (senior non trip runs) to do the work.

We senior men (now) PAID owe dues much more than YOU are now! With that said "STOP FUCKING CRYING"! Maybe one day in the future you would be a senior man and Appreciate what seniority means!

Wig I respect your opinion and just so you know I do catholic schools and could very well be affected by this even though I am in the top half of drivers at Pioneer.
But with that being said I have been a union worker all my life and seniority has been the one thing that has been respected all a long. Fortunately and yes I said Fortunately that is the one thing they have not been able to take away from us. 
Having a so called Pick only insures us that we have the same run everyday. It does not insure that a junior driver or attendant will work in the case of furloughs or layoffs.
I feel as you do and wish it was different but unfortunately it can not be. If we allowed that to happen it would undermine the very fibers that make up a union.
The Union also needs to look out for us in a way that will not allow the senior drivers or attendants the right to choose what run they take on a temporary basis. Once offered a run if they should decline they MUST be removed from the list of people looking for work. That is our only defense.

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 21, 2020, 02:04:18 PM
Sooooo as I stated.....why bother to pay union dues as a junior man if you're here one year if basically after thanksgiving I'm paying the union to screw myself over to lose my run. You can't compare this situation to another situation when it comes to seniority because this is a situation of its own. And let me be clear I'm not saying I don't respect anyone that's here 20 plus years that's not the case, my father is a retired driver I have all the respect in the world for senior drivers BUT as I said how does this situation help me. I'm paying the union to help me and look out for me by having my run taken from me. It's not fair, it's not right, it's total bs and this just doesn't affect junior men this could affect senior men too taking another senior mans run. I'm sorry but I'm firm with if your school is closed you don't work if your school is open on your run you work. That's the whole purpose picking runs. You guys stayed away from Catholic and Jewish because they come in late but now because some drivers are lucky to still have those schools open to work you wanna bump them off. What's next on a regular
day when the public schools are closed you wanna bump a guy off because you want a days pay when Jewish and Catholic is open? It's not right and this situation has nothing to do with seniority I don't care how you try and spin it. They should ask all the drivers who's schools are closed if they want to work then they would be called in seniority order if a current open school driver doesn't want to go into work.

Your run you work.....

This also has nothing to do with stirring the pot, or disrespecting anyone. I'm an employee with an opinion doesn't matter how many years you're here.

Maybe you should work at a non-union shop like Vinny's Pioneer is for a guy like you!!!

Okaaaaaay which brings me to my statement why am I paying dues to have my run potentially taken from me? How does that help me?

Prior to this pandemic I was doing trips 3-4 days a week with 3 schools in the PM(1 Jewish) at the end of the day you can't convince me that it's fair and right. It's gonna happen my opinion or not BUT you can't change my stance and opinion on it. And you have to factor in the pay scale that's a big difference if you're at top pay takin someone run during the holiday season making 21.97 or someone making less under you. Also as I said this could affect a senior man too.

And another thing ain't nobody crying over here. Simply casting my opinion as I can because I'm sure if the shoe were on the foot you'd be seeing it and talking from it too. By all means yes you earned and paid your dues over the years I'm not arguing or taking that away from you,
You earned it BUT I don't see how screwing someone over is earning your way? Is that what a union shop is lol. These are unprecedented times and I don't think
You can use the seniority card you'd use in any other case compared to this unprecedented situation

Again casting an opinion.

Quote from: faceit on November 21, 2020, 02:28:51 PM

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 21, 2020, 02:04:18 PM
Sooooo as I stated.....why bother to pay union dues as a junior man if you're here one year if basically after thanksgiving I'm paying the union to screw myself over to lose my run. You can't compare this situation to another situation when it comes to seniority because this is a situation of its own. And let me be clear I'm not saying I don't respect anyone that's here 20 plus years that's not the case, my father is a retired driver I have all the respect in the world for senior drivers BUT as I said how does this situation help me. I'm paying the union to help me and look out for me by having my run taken from me. It's not fair, it's not right, it's total bs and this just doesn't affect junior men this could affect senior men too taking another senior mans run. I'm sorry but I'm firm with if your school is closed you don't work if your school is open on your run you work. That's the whole purpose picking runs. You guys stayed away from Catholic and Jewish because they come in late but now because some drivers are lucky to still have those schools open to work you wanna bump them off. What's next on a regular
day when the public schools are closed you wanna bump a guy off because you want a days pay when Jewish and Catholic is open? It's not right and this situation has nothing to do with seniority I don't care how you try and spin it. They should ask all the drivers who's schools are closed if they want to work then they would be called in seniority order if a current open school driver doesn't want to go into work.

Your run you work.....

This also has nothing to do with stirring the pot, or disrespecting anyone. I'm an employee with an opinion doesn't matter how many years you're here.

Maybe you should work at a non-union shop like Vinny's Pioneer is for a guy like you!!!
[/quote

Guess I struck a nerve....well have a good weekend. Not gonna spend my weekend arguing over opinions myself and others share. Again it's gonna happen or it's not gonna happen, let's not get our feelings in a bunch over guys casting opinions. Stay safe, I've said all I had to say and won't be a broken record

I'm not the one writing novels

I still don't fully understand what was being asked by Andy & Anthony yesterday morning and for what exact reason.
I was asked by Anthony if I had a private school on my run.
I said yes, I do a Catholic school.
He said ok that's all I need to know and Andy said if it remains open and gets service that I have to work.
Neither one asked me my seniority number (which is around 70 but they don't know that off hand, it could be 170).
Neither one asked me if my specific Catholic school was closed if I wanted to put my name on the list to cover another private school.

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 12:56:47 PM
Damn buzz (aka double agent man )come up for air or rest those chubby little  fingers  ! Listen you pick and Sign for your run your name goes with that run ,if there's no pick you stay with that run good or bad ,he'll I hate coming in  late I was told no pick this year I'm stuck and have to deal with it  but now we pick and choose when seniority comes into play , can I than take a junior person afternoon because I don't like mine  ? The answer is NO ! But I'm senior !  If it gets that bad than we throw out the current pick let seniority rule and when school going to return we have a new pick for everyone .
Picks = seniority
Charters Runs = seniority
O/T Coverage = seniority
Your assigned run shuts down = stay home

LOL ... you should be the one talking about "chubby little fingers" ...Fuckin' Baby Huey!  ;D ;D ;D

You got the last line wrong. Should read:
Picks = seniority
Charters Runs = seniority
O/T Coverage = seniority
Your assigned run shuts down = SENIORITY

Now wrap your chubby little fingers around a paddle the size of an oar because that's what you need to STIR THE SHIT!!! Nobody does it better!  ;D ;D ;D

I'm going to venture to guess that most of these people that are complaining about what's going on probably never worked in a union Job. A union shop it's all about seniority it's all about top guys on the list and I by no means am on top of the list at Pioneer get taken care of first and then it goes down the list that's what a union is supposed to do and that's exactly what they are doing here at PIONEER. Working for UNION is not for everybody for that very reason...

Quote from: WigWag16 on November 21, 2020, 02:04:18 PM
It's not right and this situation has nothing to do with seniority I don't care how you try and spin it.

This is what you're refusing to accept. It has EVERYTHING to do with seniority and it doesn't need any spin.

You have the right to cast your own opinion, that's your right and I not saying you shouldn't. I also understand the new generations thinking "ME ME ME"! Well it's not about you!!! Your paying your dues for the good of ALL. Just like we all pay our dues, for the good of All union members. Some need it more than others, some never need it at all. This is a UNION SHOP and Seniority still matters (to a point).

BTW: I did IS than Mt. Loretta than 2 out RJJ got in after 6pm every night.

I do wish you and your family a Happy, Healthy and Safe Holidays.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 21, 2020, 02:46:26 PM
I still don't fully understand what was being asked by Andy & Anthony yesterday morning and for what exact reason.
I was asked by Anthony if I had a private school on my run.
I said yes, I do a Catholic school.
He said ok that's all I need to know and Andy said if it remains open and gets service that I have to work.
Neither one asked me my seniority number (which is around 70 but they don't know that off hand, it could be 170).
Neither one asked me if my specific Catholic school was closed if I wanted to put my name on the list to cover another private school.

I am SURE they are well aware that you are senior enough to keep your run, though they might not know your exact number off hand.

If it's just your catholic school that is closed temporarily I believe you would be given the opportunity to shape or do another run. They were not trying to cover every possible scenario yesterday, just make up a list of drivers who wanted to work according to seniority.

Quote from: WTF on November 21, 2020, 03:02:15 PM
BTW: I did IS than Mt. Loretta than 2 out RJJ got in after 6pm every night.
I do wish you and your family a Happy, Healthy and Safe Holidays.

Yep ... these new guys have no idea how easy they have it.

My 3rd, 4th, and 5th years here i did FIVE fucking schools in the afternoon. FIVE! Now they think we should surrender our seniority?
(The upside to that was I never had to worry about anybody picking my run ... LOL.)

And by they way, as far as paying union dues, we've been paying a lot longer than they have.

I do want to add that I think most newbies understand how it works. Of course they're not happy about being furloughed, but they're taking it in stride. I not only sympathize with them, I'll be on unemployment with them. But there are always those few ...

As long as they run that list the right way there should not be any issues.
Once a driver or matron is offered a run if they by chance should refuse for whatever reason they must be removed from the list.
There can be no favoritism in this instance they can not be afforded the chance to wait for a better run.
That truly is the only defense any of the drivers that may be affected by this have. Because we all know that there will be plenty of top dogs not willing to come in at 5pm or later.
This is not a pick, you are being given a chance to work should you choose to but you should not be afforded the choice in what you get.
Remember this should only be temporary and hopefully it doesn't even happen !!!!

A LOT CAN HAPPEN BETWEEN NOW AND MONDAY THE 30TH. SO STAY TUNED

I FOR ONE WILL BE WORKING THIS COMING WEEK SO FOR THOSE I WILL NOT SEE
HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍽🍁!!!!

Quote from: WTF on November 21, 2020, 02:15:20 PM
That changed when Eddie became our shop steward and made most new runs trip runs. That's one of the reasons why you don't get trips everyday and when senior men retired they made those runs trip runs.

You're exactly right ... he ruined a lot of good runs by doing that.

(So much for protecting seniority.)

buzz     ..i guess if officially laid off, we will be on the hook for 85.00 a week for medical and pension,if as reported in NY Post we keep them....

Quote from: yabba on November 21, 2020, 03:58:09 PM
buzz     ..i guess if officially laid off, we will be on the hook for 85.00 a week for medical and pension,if as reported in NY Post we keep them....

So far, as I understand it, part of the 43% will go to pay our medical and pension. But the way I see it, that's only as good as the city honoring their contract with the owners.

That's why my user name is LMAO because of this place ! To be clear to some on this web site I did the 3 schools in the AM 4 in the PM and last bus in the yard while doing 4 to 5 trips ( April,may,June ) and have been part of (A)union for over 30 yrs ! As I posted Before this does not effect me right now so there's no me me me first this is a temporary situation that should not be taken anyone's runs away . when/ if the situation changes to very long term than you wipe out the current pick make a new pick of opened schools and start from the top ! When all school reopen you do it again that the fair way to do it , but wait that involves work ! All this back and force is because of the half ass way it's being handled I'm all for treating everyone equally from #1 to #400 but the I want my money and I want it now only helps yourself  . Remember Some days you eat the bear and some days the bear eats you  !
Try and enjoy your family on this Thanksgiving and stay safe

As for Buzz 😘

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 05:13:45 PM
... this is a temporary situation that should not be taken anyone's runs away . when/ if the situation

Nobody's "taking away" anybody's run. It's simple math. If there are only 160 runs  (approximately) that are working you only need 160 drivers to do them. You have to lay off everybody else. Who do you let go? Senior drivers? C'mon man, you can't be serious.

Quote from: LMAO on November 21, 2020, 05:13:45 PM
As for Buzz 

You're still my favorite shit stirrer. Have a great Thanksgiving.  ;D

Buzz they just don't get the concept of a Union.... the only person safe in this scenario is the #1 guy that's it!!

You know that's bullshit, I believe they totally understand what a union does and means.

What I believe the real problem is is desperation, there are surely some brothers and sisters that barely got through the last furlough and now they are possibly facing another. For some of us maybe and just maybe you didn't have to worry about making your mortgage or even worse putting food on the table to feed your family. And if you are or were one of the lucky ones then good for you. I have seen people's faces in the drivers room and while talking to them personally and what I see is fear. I wish there was another way to put it but unfortunately there is not.

I am not looking into anyone's pockets but how about a little compassion for the our brothers and sisters who are less fortunate. Maybe and just maybe if you don't truly need the extra money from actually working and you can get by on unemployment plus whatever other income you have coming in you don't just work for the sake of working.

Yes this is a union shop and SENIORITY DOES ULTIMATELY PREVAIL but what about COMPASSION FOR EACH OTHER. Let's try to understand each other's anxiety and fears and possibly try not to be so uncaring.

Listen if you really need to work and your seniority affords you the option of picking someone off their run temporarily so that you can survive then by all means do what you need to.

But please I am begging you please don't look lightly at someone else who may possibly need to work to simply just get by.

This is a time to be thankful for our health and our loved ones. Some of us are not that fortunate right now. So all I am asking is PLEASE KEEP EACH OTHER IN YOUR PRAYERS AND HOPEFULLY NONE OF THIS COMES TO FRUITION AND WE ALL CAN GET BACK TO WORK COME NOVEMBER 30Th.

 Pre-COVID-19, during COVID-19 or post-COVID-19 nothing should make be any different. We are in a Union and have a contract. That contract should be honored and if it's not honored then a suit should be filed and let the courts figure it out even if it takes years. If anyone thinks that Neil and the other owners aren't fighting to get paid for April, May & June and any other money that their owed (if they didn't get it already) you're only fooling urself.
To LMAO's point
Let's take two "new hires."
Say #272 in seniority who started in October of 2016 and #350 in seniority that started in October of 2020. As per contract neither one gets paid if they don't actually work.
When Easter week rolls around (and it's not the same time as Passover) and #350 works because he has a Jewish school but #272 has to collect unemployment because all he has is public schools that are closed even though it's a temporary layoff is #272 allowed to take #350's work for that week.
The answer is NO.

how is this working....if the current #100 has a private school on his run,that driver stays on his current run.. correct? ....

There's so many different scenarios.
Bottom line ... We don't have a say ... Whatever it will be will be and none of us are going to change it.

Yabba, I was there the other day while Ernie was in the yard and to my understanding if you already have a private school, jewish school or charter school that is not in a DOE building then you have to do your OWN RUN. The only option to pick is if you only do public schools and you would be forced onto unemployment.

With that said, to my understanding  there are 20 something runs right now that fall into the private school sector that do not have a regular driver assigned to them. They would be up for pick first. Then they would be able to pick from the bottom up. But they must take the next run that is available they can not choose who's run they pick. They will be handed a run and it's either yes or no. If you have private or Jewish schools and it does not get to you you continue to do your run. They can not take it from you.

Please remember this is only temporary and does not constitute an actual pick.

I do understand the despair of the newly hired members.  I was laid off many years ago when I was not a union member.  I had my own run for 2 months when union members were brought in from another bus location.  I lost my seniority number when the union members that were brought in went ahead of me.  I was let go for a couple of months before they had a spot for me. That's how it is.  Job security with seniority.  Most  don't know what happened many years ago during the Mayor Abe Beame administration during the 1970's.  NYC was on the verge of bankruptcy and had to lay off many many employees. sanitation, cops, firemen city personnel etc. They didn't lay off from the top down.  Those with the least seniority was laid off.  Unions play a vital roll for our job security.  Our union is not perfect but necessary.

Hammer that's how in understood it also and seems fair to me

The unfortunate reality is that when it comes to being furloughed or laid off if it's not going to affect everyone that works at any union job it must happen from least senior to the most senior.
SENIORITY is truly the only thing most union jobs are still clinging to, if we allowed Pioneer to lay off who they want in an attempt to save money we would be helping to undermine the entire purpose of our union. I know it sucks and it most likely sucks more for some than others but it has to happen this way or there truly is no reason for unions.

Quote from: yabba on November 21, 2020, 08:07:11 PM
how is this working....if the current #100 has a private school on his run,that driver stays on his current run.. correct? ....

For next week, yes. For the following week it depends how many senior guys to him want to work.

Quote from: faceit on November 21, 2020, 06:28:21 PM
Buzz they just don't get the concept of a Union.... the only person safe in this scenario is the #1 guy that's it!!

Right!

Quote from: steady on November 21, 2020, 10:12:11 PM
I do understand the despair of the newly hired members.  I was laid off many years ago when I was not a union member.  I had my own run for 2 months when union members were brought in from another bus location.  I lost my seniority number when the union members that were brought in went ahead of me.  I was let go for a couple of months before they had a spot for me. That's how it is.  Job security with seniority.  Most  don't know what happened many years ago during the Mayor Abe Beame administration during the 1970's.  NYC was on the verge of bankruptcy and had to lay off many many employees. sanitation, cops, firemen city personnel etc. They didn't lay off from the top down.  Those with the least seniority was laid off.  Unions play a vital roll for our job security.  Our union is not perfect but necessary.

Excellent example. Thank you.

What will affect the Nov 30 date? de Blasio, Cummo, Covid and or Pioneer

Eucerin, it seems that NYC could potentially become an orange zone sometime in the not so distant future. If that happens before November 30th then all schools including catholic charter and Jewish would be closed therefore avoiding the temporary pick that is going to happen.
But if on November 30th Public Schools are still closed and all others are open senior drivers will be afforded the opportunity to pick a run from the bottom up to avoid being placed on unemployment.
So I think the real answer to your question is any of the above.
Dumblasio could open the Schools. ( HIGHLY UNLIKELY )
Cuomo could deem all of NYC or possibly just Staten Island an orange zone based on the positivity rate. ( VERY POSSIBLE )
Covid miraculously disappears. ( EVERYONES DREAM BUT HIGHLY UNLIKELY )
Pioneer seems to be content with the decision 1181 has made to have all runs that need to go out covered by the most senior drivers temporarily until all schools are either opened or closed. ( A DISTINCT POSSIBILITY )

Thanks Hammer2161, that make it a bit clearer to me. HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO ALL

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 22, 2020, 01:39:29 PMBut if on November 30th Public Schools are still closed and all others are open senior drivers will be afforded the opportunity to pick a run from the bottom up to avoid being placed on unemployment.

To the best of my knowledge they will not be able to "pick" a run ... they will be handed one, take it or leave it.

Sorry for not being so specific Buzz.  ;D ;D

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 22, 2020, 01:39:29 PMEucerin, it seems that NYC could potentially become an orange zone sometime in the not so distant future. If that happens before November 30th then all schools including catholic charter and Jewish would be closed therefore avoiding the temporary pick that is going to happen.

Not necessarily. I'm reading that even if schools are closed under "Orange Zone" restrictions, they could re-open after 5 days depending on testing results. In that case there would still be runs that have to be covered.

Source: https://www.governor.ny.gov/news/governor-cuomo-releases-guidelines-testing-protocol-schools-reopen-red-or-orange-micro-cluster

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 22, 2020, 03:15:30 PM
Sorry for not being so specific Buzz.  ;D ;D

That'll be 2 "Our Fathers" and 1 "Hail Mary."    ;D ;D ;D

Yes but if you read the entire article they are stating that the testing parameters would need to be changed because it would be nearly impossible to test all the students and faculty in the entire school system at once.

Truth is there are to many variables that can come in to play and we are unfortunately just stuck somewhere waiting for it to all play out.

Buzz, I just clicked that link and read the so called procedures he wants followed. In my opinion that is most certainly setting up the schools to not be able to open in a timely fashion. To many things need to happen and although it's a possibility it is surely a long shot.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 22, 2020, 03:32:20 PMTo many things need to happen and although it's a possibility it is surely a long shot.

I agree.

Hey Buzz, quick question are the matrons also going to be allowed to pick off junior matrons temporarily ? I would guess the answer is yes but just figured I would ask.

https://abc7ny.com/coronavirus-staten-island-covid-red-zone-cuomo/8175291/

Well fuck worrying about Staten Island  becoming an Orange Zone.
Cuomo just announced we are headed to a red zone as early as this week. May not have to worry about the pick off after all. This is fucking insane.

people need to wake up and start taking this virus seriously.... >:( >:( >:(

It appears to me that everyone is talking about color zones, private or public schools, senior or junior drivers, pick or handed, 85%, 100% or unemployment but somewhere lost in this shuffle is Medical Benefits. No one (and when I say no one I mean our Union or Pioneer) has told us whether or not we will continue to have our Medical Benefits on December 1st and going forward assuming public schools are still closed at that time.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 22, 2020, 10:38:39 PM
It appears to me that everyone is talking about color zones, private or public schools, senior or junior drivers, pick or handed, 85%, 100% or unemployment but somewhere lost in this shuffle is Medical Benefits. No one (and when I say no one I mean our Union or Pioneer) has told us whether or not we will continue to have our Medical Benefits on December 1st and going forward assuming public schools are still closed at that time.

very true..we get more info from the NY Post...   i will say the new text and email from pioneer was pretty nifty...

They really shouldn’t take away our benefits again..we need our benefits!  it would inhumane and unethical - especially since we will have to go back at some point just like last time.

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 22, 2020, 05:42:34 PM
Hey Buzz, quick question are the matrons also going to be allowed to pick off junior matrons temporarily ? I would guess the answer is yes but just figured I would ask.

Of course. (But a lot of them don't really want to work anyway ... LOL)

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 22, 2020, 10:38:39 PMNo one (and when I say no one I mean our Union or Pioneer) has told us whether or not we will continue to have our Medical Benefits on December 1st and going forward assuming public schools are still closed at that time.

Wouldn't hold my breath and I've explained several times why, but I'd have to assume that no news is good news and the company would send us an email in the event our coverage ceases.

Quote from: yabba on November 22, 2020, 08:14:12 PM
people need to wake up and start taking this virus seriously.... >:( >:( >:(

Yes, it's serious, but these total shut-downs of schools and businesses are bullshit! If it worked the first time there wouldn't be a second time. Infection rate doesn't matter. Death rate is down to .65% ... far lower than seasonal flu.

Actually Buzz seasonal flu has a death rate of 0.1 percent the current death rate of covid is 0.65 percent. Which still makes it 6 and a 1/2 times more deadly. Just fact checking for you lol  :)) :))

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 24, 2020, 09:08:42 AM
Actually Buzz seasonal flu has a death rate of 0.1 percent the current death rate of covid is 0.65 percent. Which still makes it 6 and a 1/2 times more deadly. Just fact checking for you lol  :)) :))

Really? Somebody should tell the CDC.

Click to enlarge ...

Well I'm not going to hold my breath but I did ask a Union Rep this morning and I was told that if we are furloughed we will keep our benefits until we return to work. So now it's a wait for the official email from Pioneer.

that makes me feel better.  some of us have issues the medical is very important and its not so easy to get new benefits especially for family coverage and preexisting medical issues. 

Buzz not really sure what that chart shows other than influenza data. But since 2010 the yearly death rate from the flu had varied from 12000 to 61000 in the United States.
So far over 258000 people have died of covid and the year is not over yet.

Hammer of course the numbers you state are fact but many of these deaths in the past year are considered Covid-19 deaths and in my opinion shouldn't have been. I'm sure in 2018 there were many that had contracted the Flu and died of a heart attack and the cause of death was officially a heart attack whereas in 2020 with the same scenario the person who died would have been considered a Covid-19 death and not a heart attack. Obviously COVID-19 is a real thing but I do believe that SOME of the numbers with regards to the death rate are being manipulated due to political and monetary reasons.

To both PROUD MEMBER AND BUZZ,

I totally agree that the numbers are a bit misleading mainly because it appears a hang nail is covid related. Just kidding but yes I get what you both are saying. But what I don't understand is people's unwillingness to wear a mask and to keep their distance when out and about.
With everything we as a country have had to endure is the past several years why do we draw the line at wearing a mask ? Just doesn't make sense.
Wether we believe the numbers or we don't this virus is very serious and it deserves our due diligence so that we can keep ourselves and others safe.

That would be disgusting again if they take away our benefits shame on Neil , we all need our benefits  >:( >:( :o

Quote from: Hammer2161 on November 24, 2020, 01:50:00 PM
But what I don't understand is people's unwillingness to wear a mask and to keep their distance when out and about.

Whoa! I'm not against masks or social distancing. I'm just saying there's no reason to shut every thing down. Keep schools and businesses open, but responsibly. If Walmart and Home Depot can operate that way there's no reason other places can't.

If the lockdowns worked the first time, why the need for a second ?

If the lockdowns didn't work the first time, why the need for a second ?

Quote from: WTF247 on November 24, 2020, 03:06:14 PM
We getting a full pay check this Friday? Worked Monday-Thursday was Friday 100 percent for not going out ?

You get paid 100% for Monday - Wednesday if you worked, 85% if you didn't.

100% for Thursday if you're here at least a year.

100% for Friday if you're here 4 years or more. No answer yet if less than 4 years will get anything for Friday.

Quote from: Buzz on November 24, 2020, 06:03:54 PM

Quote from: WTF247 on November 24, 2020, 03:06:14 PM
We getting a full pay check this Friday? Worked Monday-Thursday was Friday 100 percent for not going out ?

You get paid 100% for Monday - Wednesday if you worked, 85% if you didn't.

100% for Thursday if you're here at least a year.

100% for Friday if you're here 4 years or more. No answer yet if less than 4 years will get anything for Friday.

Sorry Buzz I meant the paycheck this week for last weeks work? Friday when we came in and just signed the card and left was that 100 percent or 85?

Quote from: WTF247 on November 24, 2020, 06:06:26 PM
Sorry Buzz I meant the paycheck this week for last weeks work? Friday when we came in and just signed the card and left was that 100 percent or 85?

As long as you went in and filled out your card Friday you'll get full pay.

Gotcha thanks so I
Should get my regular paycheck this Friday for last week 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽

Quote from: WTF247 on November 24, 2020, 06:11:25 PM
Gotcha thanks so I
Should get my regular paycheck this Friday for last week 🙌🏽🙌🏽🙌🏽

Yes.

Aren't we getting paid tomorrow?

If you have direct deposit the money is already in your account.

Ahhh so we got paid today instead of Friday cause of the
Holidays I assume

Hey Buzz......for us drivers that are likely having our runs given away meaning we won't work Monday, when should we hand in our monthly driving logs? Today or go in he office Monday?

Looks like the furlough is coming. Pioneer sent an email that routes are being worked on by the union.

Quote from: rc1790 on November 25, 2020, 04:53:21 PM
Looks like the furlough is coming. Pioneer sent an email that routes are being worked on by the union.

I'm calling bullshit but it is what it is, making stuff up as they go. I just paid union dues to have a decision not benefit me at all.

So when they say routes are being deleted.....those runs will be active again once school opens back up and guys who had their runs given away will get their runs back

When schools reopen routes should go back to the way they are now. The other thing is, what happens if they reopen in stages? And are they carrying shapes now based on seniority?

Quote from: rc1790 on November 25, 2020, 05:09:17 PM
When schools reopen routes should go back to the way they are now. The other thing is, what happens if they reopen in stages? And are they carrying shapes now based on seniority?

Making stuff as they go bro.

No bro it's called union seniority

So do we officially not report on Monday or do we wait for official notice that our run was taken from us

This is what the union is supposed to do You have no valid complaint.

How many runs are operating at this moment?
Also are they talking company seniority or union seniority

Deblaiso just said he's looking to
Role out a new reopening plan this coming week to have all schools open with more testing

Quote from: sbdriver1 on November 25, 2020, 05:49:45 PM
How many runs are operating at this moment?
Also are they talking company seniority or union seniority

Not sure but I think just under 130. Company seniority.

Last I heard the Union is planning on all non public schools that are in the current orange zone (which could change by Monday) to be closed starting Monday. Yesterday they were calling members in seniority order to see if they want to work no matter what run they might be handed. I would ASSUME to be on the safe side they probably called the top 150 to 180 drivers because I think Monday morning (if nothing changes) there should be around 100 active runs.
Having said that I would assume those of us that are going to work will be contacted by Sunday.
With regards to what run you will be doing I doubt if we'll know before Monday morning but in order to make it easier for the driver I hope I'm wrong. What I think will happen is whoever is told to come in will be told to be in by 5:30 or 6:00 and there will be a line in seniority order and you will be handed a run and go on ur way. If that be the case for those of us that may say that's ridiculous because you need time to look at the run please don't even go there. First of all you should think of the other nearly 300 drivers that aren't working and thank God you are. Secondly, the top 100 drivers range from people with around 20 to 40 years of service so it's definitely not the first time especially in recent years that you came in at 6:00am and was handed a run and made it through the morning. Lastly we also have to realize that nearly half of these runs will probably be PM only so you'll have all morning to familiarize yourself with it.
God Bless Eveyone & Our Union and Happy Thanksgiving to All

there needs to be an official statemet by 1181 on how this is working...the phone calls made did not have answers... a lot of drivers got different answers to how this is working...

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 26, 2020, 10:19:45 AM
I think Monday morning (if nothing changes) there should be around 100 active runs.

You might be right but I don't know how everybody who attends in-person classes will get tested and have their negative results so soon.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 26, 2020, 10:19:45 AM
... there will be a line in seniority order and you will be handed a run and go on ur way.

Not sure exactly how it will work but if someone has enough seniority to work and their school is open, they're supposed to get their own run to do.

I'm sure there will be ample confusion. Nothing like this has been done before.

Quote from: yabba on November 26, 2020, 10:42:48 AM
there needs to be an official statemet by 1181 on how this is working...the phone calls made did not have answers... a lot of drivers got different answers to how this is working...

I knew the cartoon I saw in the Advance the other day would come in handy ...



Ernie was at Pioneer much of the day yesterday to make sure that this would be handled in a way that keeps seniority intact. Now it's up to the company to implement it in that way basis the runs that will be working.

Listen, nobody has any experience in this situation because it has never happened before. With a constantly changing list of which schools will be open, nobody should expect this to go smoothly.

The phone call I received didn't make any sense. I asked three questions regarding what was said and I received three "I don't knows"

im not knocking the way its going... i just think the phone calls were not 100% and we need clarity to exactly what the final answers are...yes its a mess and noone fault but corona ,but we need to know the 100% were  we are going to stand ..

When I said there should be approximately 100 active runs if nothing changes I was referring to  if Cuomo doesn't make more of SI orange zones in which case there would be less than 100 active runs.

Also as far as the confusion I myself don't see why there will be any confusion. Drivers will go in and if their run is active they will go out and do their route if their route is not active they will be handed another route and they will go out and do that route. As I said all the drivers that will be working have 20 to 40 years experience there should be no confusion.

I for one doubt it will be that simple of a process. All they did on Wednesday was collect names of people that potentially want to work. It is my understanding that when you are handed a run you will at that time be afforded the opportunity to say no and be placed on furlough at that time. And to be honest I potentially see that happening quite a bit especially at the top of the seniority list when they are handed a run with an out that's after 4pm. The only downside I can see from what I was told is once you say no you are furloughed until all the work comes back.

I truly doubt they will call in enough guys initially to cover the work that will go out on Monday morning simply because you have no clue how many will say no at that time. Also they must allow for the drivers who do work to do their own schools in the event their school is open. If this truly falls on the office staff we all know it will be mass confusion to say the least. Good luck everyone.

Obviously whoever is working will find out Monday morning but I doubt if one member refuses a run. Everyone has been told in advance that you will be handed a run regardless of the in and out time. If you weren't willing to take the chance of getting a late out then you should have said NO from the beginning. Besides what senior member is going to refuse grossing $1,335.00 a week and taking home $900.00 as compared to $504 a week.

PROUD MEMBER, I would normally agree with you but I happened to be there while they were calling the drivers and it seemed that some if not many were on the fence. Either way the work needs to be distributed in seniority order and if you say no you should not be given a second chance. I for one would not be going on unemployment if given the chance to work and earn a full salary. Either way only time will tell and hopefully it does go smoothly. Have a Happy Thanksgiving 🦃!!!!

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 26, 2020, 03:27:55 PM
Obviously whoever is working will find out Monday morning but I doubt if one member refuses a run. Everyone has been told in advance that you will be handed a run regardless of the in and out time. If you weren't willing to take the chance of getting a late out then you should have said NO from the beginning. Besides what senior member is going to refuse grossing $1,335.00 a week and taking home $900.00 as compared to $504 a week.

so your saying the number 10 driver  gets a 4:30 school and the number 95 driver gets a 2:00 out ,he should be happy he is getting 1335. a week,and his 30 years on the job means nothing,,

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 26, 2020, 01:25:18 PM
When I said there should be approximately 100 active runs if nothing changes I was referring to  if Cuomo doesn't make more of SI orange zones in which case there would be less than 100 active runs.

You're right ... I'm forgetting that ... as of now ... part of the island is still only yellow.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on November 26, 2020, 03:27:55 PM
Besides what senior member is going to refuse grossing $1,335.00 a week and taking home $900.00 as compared to $504 a week.

I did ... as did others. (And I don't even take home $800 ... let alone 900)

I think they will be handing out the 4:30 out schools towards the end so would think the most senior drivers don't have to worry about that

Quote from: faceit on November 26, 2020, 04:30:47 PM
I think they will be handing out the 4:30 out schools towards the end so would think the most senior drivers don't have to worry about that

which would sound fair and understandable.

Quote from: yabba on November 26, 2020, 04:20:10 PMso your saying the number 10 driver  gets a 4:30 school and the number 95 driver gets a 2:00 out ,he should be happy he is getting 1335. a week,and his 30 years on the job means nothing,,

Yep ... it may not be completely fair in that sense, but it's basically a "work or don't work" situation, not a choice of runs. It's going to be a daunting enough task, I doubt the office is going to cherry pick runs basis seniority.

Quote from: faceit on November 26, 2020, 04:30:47 PM
I think they will be handing out the 4:30 out schools towards the end so would think the most senior drivers don't have to worry about that

Hopefully it will work out that way. As far as I know, open runs will be assigned first, followed by runs that were given to very new drivers that were previously open runs ... in other words, runs they did not pick. Then the leftovers will be assigned ... take it or leave it.

if you take a handed run and the drivers orange school opens back up,the driver goes back to his original run correct

these are the questions drivers all seem to have a different version of the answer... the phone calls and the list they may have made is not going to be accurate...again its a mess and too many interpertations of the answers.. noone is to blame but i think we all need to report and be told this is what is going to be and how it is working... we need a letter like the last email with the 1181 letter head on the pay for thanksgivings week...thats was 100% perfect... we need more communications like that...

Quote from: yabba on November 26, 2020, 04:52:22 PM
if you take a handed run and the drivers orange school opens back up,the driver goes back to his original run correct

I believe that's the way it's supposed to work.

Quote from: Buzz on November 26, 2020, 05:27:03 PM

Quote from: yabba on November 26, 2020, 04:52:22 PM
if you take a handed run and the drivers orange school opens back up,the driver goes back to his original run correct

I believe that's the way it's supposed to work.

thanks Buzz...and a Happy Thanksgiving to you...and we are all thankful to you for this website...you basically are our lifeline to the truth on whats going on during this crazy year all around...myself and im sure the rest of us here appreciate the time you spend getting us the facts from ernie and relaying to us all here to see,and help us understand wording..thanks again..

No one is saying that a driver with 30 years experience means nothing. What I heard is to not have any confusion or favoritism is that they will take all the runs that need to be covered and put them in numbered sequence order and then hand them out to the drivers in seniority order. I don't know if that's true or not but it makes a lot of sense to me. Otherwise if you have say 70 runs that need to be covered, then someone has figure out which run is better than the next run which is virtually impossible that's the reason they're not having a pick. It's the only fair solution without having a pick and that's why we were told ahead of time that you may get something you don't like.

     First of all Happy Thanksgiving to the entire Pioneer family. Buzz I have a question you maybe can answer. The posts I am reading says that the office is calling senior drivers to see if they want to work. Well I am under 75 in seniority and have reeved no call. Can you shed any light on this? Thanks!

Hideout
Did you work this week and if so do you know if your school is in an orange zone?
If your school is not in an orange zone then I would assume that's why you did not receive a phone call.

    I didn't work this week and my am schools are not in an orange zone but my pm schools are.

Well hideout in that case if you don't receive a phone call tomorrow I would call Andy and tell him your seniority number and tell him that you never received a phone call Unless maybe you already told them previously that you wanted to work

.   Thanks Proud Member I'll reach out tomorrow. And no I haven't talked to Andy or Pioneer. Thanks again.

Quote from: hideout on November 26, 2020, 06:29:52 PM
     First of all Happy Thanksgiving to the entire Pioneer family. Buzz I have a question you maybe can answer. The posts I am reading says that the office is calling senior drivers to see if they want to work. Well I am under 75 in seniority and have reeved no call. Can you shed any light on this? Thanks!

Happy Thanksgiving to you, too.

So, you only do public schools, correct? Did Andy or Anthony not ask you last week if you wanted to work this coming week? (Are you at Sharrotts? Don't know if Tony was taking names there.) If they already have you on the list they wouldn't need to call. If you have any doubt give Andy a call.

Quote from: yabba on November 26, 2020, 05:56:01 PM
thanks Buzz...and a Happy Thanksgiving to you...and we are all thankful to you for this website...you basically are our lifeline to the truth on whats going on during this crazy year all around...myself and im sure the rest of us here appreciate the time you spend getting us the facts from ernie and relaying to us all here to see,and help us understand wording..thanks again..

Happy Thanksgiving to you too, yabba. I appreciate your expression of gratitude. I do what I can ... but sometimes I don't even understand the wording ... LOL.

(After all these years I have absolutely no idea who you are. I know some people, mostly  because they have told me voluntarily. If you care to do so please PM me, but no pressure.)

Absolutely!Thank you Buzz for all your work you do on this website.Happy Thanksgiving to you and to all!God bless you and your families!

Quote from: LMR on November 27, 2020, 04:06:06 AM
Absolutely!Thank you Buzz for all your work you do on this website.Happy Thanksgiving to you and to all!God bless you and your families!

Hope you had a good one too, bud ... and thanks.