Furlough

[WigWag16]

So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID !  so your stuck on the run from last year , I Didn't hear to may senior people complaining about it then . So people who were looking to switch run where shit out of luck and the non public school drivers who came in well past everyone else regardless of seniority were stuck . But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so their is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

PREACH LMAO 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

[WigWag16]

So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID !  so your stuck on the run from last year , I Didn't hear to may senior people complaining about it then . So people who were looking to switch run where shit out of luck and the non public school drivers who came in well past everyone else regardless of seniority were stuck . But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so their is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

I agree 100 percent with this. I don't want to hear well "we pay dues and this is a union thing" that makes 0 sense because at the end of the day guess what? I'm paying dues into the union too soooo I'm Basically paying dues for someone to steal my run because my run has a school that's currently open? It's unfair and makes 0 sense. I can understand if someone says you know what I don't want to work. They go to the list and they go from top to bottom who wants to work, not well this guys school is closed I'm gonna pick his run....for what an extra 15 percent compared to a guy who is going to get sent to the unemployment line and make crap.  85 percent of top pay to sit home is pretty good to me compared to new guys or middle numbered guys that need the 100 percent more in my opinion. It's gonna be what it's gonna be but it's not fair at all for example number 78 to take number 250 or 350 run because they have a Jewish or catholic school open at the time. And again why am I paying dues if this happens and my run gets taken from me. How does that help me? It doesn't.  I'm all about putting time in and earning your spot but not during this time of life. That's not how you take care of people. You don't reward others by punishing others especially during this time. That's all I'll say on this

[yabba]

Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about. 

[PROUD MEMBER]

I haven't heard anything definitively from the Union or Pioneer (the company that signs our checks) with regards to November 30th and after. Will the private schools still get service and which drivers will work is a good question. I understand seniority but My Opinion is if the private schools still get bus service than whoever's run it is should work AS LONG AS the employees that do not work get 85% pay.
IF it is people who work get 100% pay and those that don't work get unemployment than I believe you would have to go by seniority.
Obviously the best scenario as far as less separation between drivers would be that just like for the month of April, no buses roll and we ALL keep our benefits and get 85%. But having said that depending on how long public schools are closed in the long run it might be better for the industry and us if private schools still get bus service.
Hopefully all schools will reopen November 30th. Unfortunately and I hope I'm wrong my personal opinion is if public schools do not reopen November 30th that all bus service will stop even if the private schools remain open (which they may not). At that point we'll all be furloughed (unemployed) again but this time I believe we'll keep our medical benefits. The Medical Benefits is the biggest concern for the overwhelming majority of us throughout the industry including us at Pioneer!!!
Go Bless Everyone

[Buzz]

So let me get this straight when I enquired about a pick for the year Or second part of the year  I was told we can't because of COVID ! ... But wait now that the gravy train of very early or half day dismissal is shut down LETS HAVE A PICK BY SENIORITY !!🤬 what a absolutely shit show so there is no reason not to have a a second half pick , Right  . Question so what happens when this passes and it will pass do the senior drivers stay on there new late runs ? You chose your run in the beginning the good the bad and the ugly and if the driver doesn't want  to work his non public school by all means give it to a senior driver TO COVER but to throw people off their run is total BULLSHIT . Unity 😂  either have a pick or don't not only when it works for some !

AND Yes I'm in the top half of seniority , no this does not effect my run but I have to call bullshit when I see it !

Man, you love to stir the shit ... and you're the best! That's why you're the King of All Shit Stirrers! 

First of all, there IS NO PICK now. Those senior men who want to work will be HANDED A RUN ... take it or leave it. And after they've exhausted the runs that aren't currently covered by a permanent driver they will assign the non-public school runs of the  lowest drivers in seniority.

Do you know what that means? Jewish schools ... probably won't get in until 5:30, maybe later. But to answer your question, when schools re-open, everybody will go back to the runs they had before schools closed.

I disagree that senior men don't want a pick. Some would love to get some of those sweet trip runs ... being there are no trips now.

Some years ago we lost a bunch of runs in the fall. About 15 people were laid off, or some were offered to work in the Bronx. Many of the runs that were cut were senior man runs. Do you think they were laid off? Of course not ... guys at the bottom of the list were, even though their runs weren't affected. It's all about seniority.

It's like that in any union industry ... those with more seniority get to work before those with less. I don't see how guys didn't understand this when they started this job. It's what they signed on for ... but now they want to complain about it.

I know some do so because they desperately need the money, and I sympathize with them, but that's the harsh reality of a union structure and it was their choice to be a part of it.

On the other hand, some people just complain because they love to STIR THE SHIT!!! 

[Buzz]

Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about.

Highly unlikely. It's going to be unemployment, most likely. If it were 85%, I think most senior drivers would stay home rather than work for 15%.

[Buzz]

I haven't heard anything definitively from the Union or Pioneer (the company that signs our checks) with regards to November 30th and after. Will the private schools still get service and which drivers will work is a good question.

Maybe I misunderstand the question, but if non-public schools are still open come the 30th, the senior drivers who told Andy they want to work will be doing those runs ... it's for that week that he was asking people with the assumption (at this point) that it will be a choice between working or unemployment.

[Buzz]

....for what an extra 15 percent compared to a guy who is going to get sent to the unemployment line and make crap.  85 percent of top pay to sit home is pretty good to me compared to new guys or middle numbered guys that need the 100 percent more in my opinion.

I'm pretty sure the 85% will only be for next week and as I understand the way Andy's doing it, everybody will be on their own runs for Thanksgiving week. The week of the 30th it will most likely be a choice of working for 100% or getting unemployment. Nonetheless, I know a number of senior men, (including myself), who declined to work and go on unemployment, meaning those who need it more will work. Don't paint all senior guys with one brush.

I'm all about putting time in and earning your spot but not during this time of life. That's not how you take care of people. You don't reward others by punishing others especially during this time. That's all I'll say on this

If not "during this time of life" then when? A guy with one year on the job should earn before a guy with 25 years? Is that what you're saying? It's when the shit hits the fan that seniority counts the most and it IS how you take care of those people ... and they all earned their spot over many years.

I know there are people who are in much more dire need than others and I honestly sympathize with them. But this is how it works in a union shop and if they didn't understand that coming in and can't accept it now, they might want to consider a career change because it's going to be a lot of years before they realize the benefit of seniority when it really matters.

[yabba]

Are you guys sure the senior guys are going to be on 85% on Nov 30th...or maybe you can guarantee the 85% to the senior drivers....seniority is what union is about.

Highly unlikely. It's going to be unemployment, most likely. If it were 85%, I think most senior drivers would stay home rather than work for 15%.

i agree buzz and the reality is its going to be Unemployment..  this is all inline to what the NY Post reported over a month ago... after 5 days of school closing ,contractors would go to 43%....

[PROUD MEMBER]

From reading different posts here I'm a little confused also. My take from what Andy & Anthony were asking yesterday morning was

1. Do you currently have a private school on ur run.

If u said yes than u were told u have to do that run.

If u said no than u were asked if u would want to cover an OPEN private school run if available and ur name would be put on a list and u would be HANDED a run in seniority order and after seniority if there are still open runs left you would be handed a run from the bottom of seniority up.

Also I was under the impression that they were only talking about Monday, Tuesday & Wednesday of this upcoming week. I didn't think but then again I didn't ask if they were talking about November 30th and after.

[Buzz]

From reading different posts here I'm a little confused also. My take from what Andy & Anthony were asking yesterday morning was

1. Do you currently have a private school on ur run.

If u said yes than u were told u have to do that run.

If u said no than u were asked if u would want to cover an OPEN private school run if available and ur name would be put on a list and u would be HANDED a run in seniority order and after seniority if there are still open runs left you would be handed a run from the bottom of seniority up.

Also I was under the impression that they were only talking about Monday, Tuesday & Wednesday of this upcoming week. I didn't think but then again I didn't ask if they were talking about November 30th and after.

Originally, Ernie said the "bumping" would start next week. Andy, however, was lining up people to work for the week beginning the 30th. It was just too short notice for him to get a list together and assign runs to take effect this Monday so, as I understand it, everybody who has a non-public school run will do those runs Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday. I will double-check with him later to make sure I understand it correctly.

(There were probably not many senior drivers who would have wanted to work for 15% for those 3 days anyway.)

[LMAO]

Damn buzz (aka double agent man )come up for air or rest those chubby little  fingers  ! Listen you pick and Sign for your run your name goes with that run ,if there's no pick you stay with that run good or bad ,he'll I hate coming in  late I was told no pick this year I'm stuck and have to deal with it  but now we pick and choose when seniority comes into play , can I than take a junior person afternoon because I don't like mine  ? The answer is NO ! But I'm senior !  If it gets that bad than we throw out the current pick let seniority rule and when school going to return we have a new pick for everyone .
Picks = seniority
Charters Runs = seniority
O/T Coverage = seniority
Your assigned run shuts down = stay home

[Hammer2161]

Well for several reasons I believe we are putting the cart before the horse,
1- This will only come into play if Cuomo doesn't deem all of NYC an Orange Zone which pretty much seems inevitable with the positivity rates being what they are.
2- Potentially Staten Island could become an Orange Zone all on its own since our positivity rate has been well over 4 percent for 11 straight days now.
3- Also as of Friday from what I was told there are 20 or more runs that are not currently covered by a permanent driver that would come into play first.

Now here is where it will get good after those 20 or more runs are given out they will start from the bottom up with runs that have work on the 30th and offer them to the senior drivers who are still looking to work. I for one do not see many of the senior drivers who are looking to work doing so if it means they will be getting in after 5 pm or possibly later than that.
What has to happen at that point is once you are offered a run and you say no, you need to be removed from the list and forfeit you chance at working.
I know this isn't a what a lot of people want to hear but WE ARE A UNION SHOP. And simply put because of that if people have to be furloughed and put on unemployment it has to be the people with less seniority unless people volunteer.
For a lot of reasons I know this will be troubling for many if not all of us. But please try to remember we all took a union job and therefore union rules have to apply.

MY FELLOW BROTHERS AND SISTERS IT IS THANKSGIVING WEEK AND HARD AS THIS MAY BE TO HEAR PLEASE TRY TO BE THANKFUL FOR WHATEVER IT IS THAT IS POSITIVE IN YOUR LIFE.
UNFORTUNATELY FOR A LOT OF US THAT WILL NOT BE SO SIMPLE THIS COMING HOLIDAY SEASON AND I ASK THAT WE ALL KEEP THOSE PEOPLE IN OUR PRAYERS.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING 🦃🍽🍁 TO EVERYONE AND MAY GOD WATCH OVER ALL OF US AND HELP TO SEE ALL OF US THROUGH THESE TROUBLING TIMES. GOOD BLESS !!!!

[WigWag16]

Sooooo as I stated.....why bother to pay union dues as a junior man if you're here one year if basically after thanksgiving I'm paying the union to screw myself over to lose my run. You can't compare this situation to another situation when it comes to seniority because this is a situation of its own. And let me be clear I'm not saying I don't respect anyone that's here 20 plus years that's not the case, my father is a retired driver I have all the respect in the world for senior drivers BUT as I said how does this situation help me. I'm paying the union to help me and look out for me by having my run taken from me. It's not fair, it's not right, it's total bs and this just doesn't affect junior men this could affect senior men too taking another senior mans run. I'm sorry but I'm firm with if your school is closed you don't work if your school is open on your run you work. That's the whole purpose picking runs. You guys stayed away from Catholic and Jewish because they come in late but now because some drivers are lucky to still have those schools open to work you wanna bump them off. What's next on a regular
day when the public schools are closed you wanna bump a guy off because you want a days pay when Jewish and Catholic is open? It's not right and this situation has nothing to do with seniority I don't care how you try and spin it. They should ask all the drivers who's schools are closed if they want to work then they would be called in seniority order if a current open school driver doesn't want to go into work.

Your run you work.....

This also has nothing to do with stirring the pot, or disrespecting anyone. I'm an employee with an opinion doesn't matter how many years you're here.

[WTF]

LMAO - WigWag16 - I would consider myself a Senior man. I have a school that will be open, and most likely will be able to work at 100% salary doing my run that I picked After Nov.30. So any changes really does not affect me, unless I choose NOT to work and go on unemployment, as Buzz intends to do.

Now how can you justify that "IF" I didn't have a school open with my Seniority and Furloughed (unemployment) , that a Junior man is working and earning a Full salary (no matter what his pay scale is). Do you think that's right?

Let me tell you something you probably don't know. When I started my run was 3 schools in the AM and 4 schools in the PM with TRIPS! Trips were everyday, 5 days a week and if you were lucky you got maybe 1 or 2 days a month you didn't get a trip!!! That's a FACT and the Truth!!! That changed when Eddie became our shop steward and made most new runs trip runs. That's one of the reasons why you don't get trips everyday and when senior men retired they made those runs trip runs. That's why there are Nice trip runs and you DON'T do trips everyday, because there are more trip runs (senior non trip runs) to do the work.

We senior men (now) PAID owe dues much more than YOU are now! With that said "STOP FUCKING CRYING"! Maybe one day in the future you would be a senior man and Appreciate what seniority means!