1181 Drivers Forum

Looks like we'll know what's what either later today or early tomorrow. Just wanted to start a new thread for that discussion so as not to add on to the "Secrecy" thread. Post your comments here.

Does it come with VASOLINE? or should we bring our own?? :wink_cheesy: :wink_cheesy:

So than it's a done deal. Approved, signed, whatever? The bottom line is that it is ready for the Membership to review? Is that correct?

Quote from: Buzz on February 09, 2016, 05:36:52 PM
Looks like we'll know what's what either later today or early tomorrow.

7 1/2 months of keeping the membership in the dark.    It better be worth it.

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on February 09, 2016, 07:21:53 PM
So than it's a done deal. Approved, signed, whatever? The bottom line is that it is ready for the Membership to review? Is that correct?

Ernie is on his way to the union hall as of the time of this posting (4:30 p.m.), as Michael and others are on their way back from Albany. He says everybody will have copies of the MOA tomorrow morning.

(I think it's safe to say we won't be getting anything near the 32% increase the city council voted for itself.)

Just remember if you don't like this contract vote no or accept the contract and don't bitch about it. Don't fall for the best and final bullshit, vote no or deal with it. By the way that includes me. ( vote yes don't bitch, or just vote no and we can still bitch.

im looking forward to getting back 3/4 of the 3600.00+ i lost in last contract..so thats 2700.00 plus raises for the next 3 years... thats the only way i might vote yes..

Yes, worker341 makes a good point. It is not Michael's job  (or Ernie's, for that matter) ... or right ... to decide what is a good contract. It is his OBLIGATION to present to us their offer and it is up to us to decide whether to accept it or not.

Quote from: yabba on February 10, 2016, 12:31:51 AM
im looking forward to getting back 3/4 of the 3600.00+ i lost in last contract..so thats 2700.00 plus raises for the next 3 years... thats the only way i might vote yes..

Don't forget a 2% yearly cost of living adjustment (COLA) for the last 3 1/2 years and add that 7% to your loss.

Yabba
I have no idea what the new offer looks like but I'm pretty sure that you will be voting no. $2700 plus raises! Sounds great but I think that's a stretch. Let's hope I'm wrong. We'll see tomorrow.

A no vote leaves you with his best and final offer.There will be no going back to the table for a new agreement.Lets hope this MOA is respectable.We certainly waited long enough.

Sad pitiful disgrace    Is this a joke   

Did I read it right that we get all our accruel money(5 days a check) at the end  of our contract  June 2018??? Are you fu€king kidding me this contract is a fu(#ing JOKE!!!!!!!we got nothing back!!!! VOTE NO!!!!!

Holy crap, look where our sick days are coming from !

so we DID NOT get back xmas week we DID NOT get back Feb week we DID NOT get back the 4 hours for working a holiday we DID NOT get back the full pay for snow days.. But we have to pay for sick days, and if i read it right  we dont get full 5 days of accural checks until june 2018... are you fuc&ing kidding me the owners lost NOTHING and continue to take from us... Good job Michael i think its time to go now you've done enough Damage!!!!!! :thumbdown: SHAME ON ANYONE WHO TRIES TO JUSTIFY THIS WASTE OF PAPER!!!!!<<<<<<<<<<<VOTE NO!!!!!!!>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Did you REALLY expect anything DIFFERENT? :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb: :bomb:

please correct me...it seems neil is paying less into the welfare fund...a  failed welfare fund...also what happenes to our sick days if we dont use them,are we paid for them.... also it seems the new hires without wage accurals can take 5 sick days without penalties.....

And why does the raise take place January 1st 2016. It should go back to September 2015. Sorry but I am voting NO also. And we didnt get back the 40 week guarantee.

I hope that this message will reach all of the workers at PIONEER. They ONLY way this contract gets voted DOWN is if they honestly count the tabulated votes in front of us!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Otherwise ya all got what ya wanted when U voted for Michael Cordielol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!And being told that the medical is based on the fact that this contract should pass is an insult on the intelligence of you and me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Wake up people we are smarter than this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1) Because Mike was out-negotiated and outsmarted at the last contract, we are taking a fucking.  I know it, Mike knows it, and this Buzz knows it.

Messages - Buzz
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181Work Related / Re: Is this what they're offering?
« on: October 25, 2015, 08:06:58 AM »
Back In November 2013 when we were asked to approve our most recent contract, I thought, instead of having a clause that it could be renegotiated, it should have had a clause that stated if Pioneer got an extension we would automatically revert back to our previously approved contract (i.e., not the "imposed" one).

Being our approval of our latest contract was predicated on the assumption that the company would need the leverage to bid competitively, and that it turned out this was not necessary, we should have had the benefit of a contract "extension" ... just as the company did.

Had this been the case, negotiations now would be starting off where we were before the strike, instead of starting off in a hole and having to fight (and maybe strike) just to get back what we once had.

2) Owner greed has gone to a new level.

3) If approved, the job is over.

This contract is a joke.  We've been sold out.

I gave Mike this contract to make things right.  Failed miserably.  My family and I can no longer have you negotiate for us.

It just goes to prove that Michael works for the owners not for the membership

Buzz and ALL the Think Tankers are sitting at the round table trying to come up with a way to SELL this to us at Pioneer! Why do you think it's taking him sooooooooo Looooooong to respond?

The next vote should be on starting impeachment proceedings..You SOLD US OUT AGAIN Michael how do you sleep at night? SELL OUT!!!!!

7 1/2 months of being kept in the dark and now we have 48 hours to vote on it.  If they're in a rush for my vote, then here it is right now.  No fuckin way!!!

John not even buzz can make this sound good, I think he's smarter then that...

No pension increase again for another 3 years.  Every one is still working for the Friday morning check.  Our executive board will do fine as always.

IMPEACH!!!!!!!

best and final offer ,,go fuk youself ,,set up the barrels and lets hit the brcks and call his bluff,,right after the break sounds about right

where are you buzz i know it doesnt take that long to realize we are getting fuked on this one>>>> are you getting coached on what to say? we want to hear your input

ok i cooled down a little bit,,, who had the balls to put this MOA on paper and hand it out,,,just looked in the mirror i dont see fool etched on my forehead

christ where the hell is 3/4 of the pie i was told about... my god am i missing some pages

Vote NO!!!!

And before some one tells me "at least you have a job".  Don't do it.  Until these buses can drive themselves, we are valuable, and deserve a decent raise and good contract.

Hey neil the next strike wont be as pretty as the last one!!!!!!!

we have no time for impeach...we have time next week to go stand in front of union hall and have our voices heard and maybe michael will be a man and step down for the best of the membership and take his brother with him... i have no problem striking but i will stay home before i will walk a picket line under this mans rule...he must step down and we need to let him know... next week lets start being heard...

how could we vote yes, just on the welfare fund in 2017... we know its a failure,looks to me less money will be paid into it and in 2017 the trustees decides we need 300.00 more a month we pay 150.00 of it...read it understand it vote no we going to get fucked even more.. dont look at 1181 examples of an increase   im telling you it will be 300.00 a month at a minimum...

Just a point of reference for the people who are not familiar with the sick days approved by the NY State Assembly. All companies that employ 20 or more workers are subject to giving those employees 5 sick days annually, under the terms of the law. This law went into effect April 1, 2014. Employees who work under union contracts are bound by collective bargaining. The 5 sick days were bargained OUT of the contract that 1181 has with the contractors. Thank You once again Mr. Cordiello!

Hey! We get to pay for our own sick days!!! What else do you want?

Seriously though, just by rough calculation and not knowing how much we could eventually be paying toward our medical ... and even with our "big" raise ... by the end of this contract in 2018 I could well be making LESS than I did at the end of the 2012 school year!!! (And that's not even taking into account the increased co-pays and reduced benefits that we were handed last year.) So I certainly am not going to try to tell anybody how to vote.

However, I don't blame Michael. It took 19 meetings for our negotiators to even get this much out of the greedy owners. His job ... his OBLIGATION ... is to present the offer to us, for better or for worse, NOT to decide that for us. It is solely in our hands to accept it or not. We passed a strike vote months ago. It is at OUR discretion as to whether or not to act on it.

Just goes to show how Fucking incompetent they are. They could of gotten this done in 30 seconds and saved 18 trips to the bargaining table!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote from: Buzz on February 10, 2016, 04:15:53 PM

However, I don't blame Michael.

I knew this was coming.

Yes, John, because it's just as easy as you think ...

New hires seem to benefit the most. 17.50 an hour,5 sick days without paying for them, medical after a year, and raises on top of it. Talk about
the opposite of eating your young. They may some day replace the rest of us. Drivers with 3 years on are at the 17 dollar level.

Hey Mike!   I bet your ears are ringing right now.

Buzz let me school you on what I Think. I HAVE negotiated contracts in the real estate industry. I KNOW what it takes to get things to finality. THIS IS A FUCKING EMBARRASSMENT! And to think that there is NOT is tunnel vision on your part. Cordiello negotiated the 5 sicks days OUT of the CBA for 1181. I understand that this web site is a filter for the business of 1181. PLEASE don't insult our INTELLIGENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:

now it makes sense as to why this was kept quiet till this morning ...and yes its michaels doing   he should have never even presented this to us... we were told the meeting were unproductive,then everything went hush hush... please dont bullshit me..

Buzz I've officially lost all respect for you and now know for sure you write what you are told to write Michael is all to blame,  he should have taken a page out of the Neil's book and got up and walked out of negotiations before even considering showing this to the members... Come on Buzz who does is to blame

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion based upon personal needs.  Based upon a review I only see the 1% raises and raises for the new guys.  No sick days, it's taken out of our accrual, no pension increase, nothing pertaining to what we previously lost.  I'm voting no. 

This is a reason why we should have Pioneer  only union meetings. There are more questions than answers and 2 days to digest it and vote. What is the rush to vote? Where are the union heads to explain this offer?

Quote from: rc1790 on February 10, 2016, 04:24:55 PM
New hires seem to benefit the most. 17.50 an hour,5 sick days without paying for them, medical after a year, and raises on top of it. Talk about
the opposite of eating your young. They may some day replace the rest of us. Drivers with 3 years on are at the 17 dollar level.

Yep, it struck me the same way. It's as if they're pitting the senior drivers against the new hires. And they will replace us. They probably had to up the starting pay to attract more drivers who will never see much more than that.

Quote from: rc1790 on February 10, 2016, 05:05:38 PM
This is a reason why we should have Pioneer  only union meetings. There are more questions than answers and 2 days to digest it and vote. What is the rush to vote? Where are the union heads to explain this offer?

Ernie was there after the morning run to answer any questions and probably will be throughout the day.

Quote from: John Eadicicco on February 10, 2016, 03:17:17 PM
Buzz and ALL the Think Tankers are sitting at the round table trying to come up with a way to SELL this to us at Pioneer! Why do you think it's taking him sooooooooo Looooooong to respond?

Not me. You can't put enough lipstick on this contract to make it look like anything but a pig.

So, you're going to vote NO also.

Quote from: John Eadicicco on February 10, 2016, 03:17:17 PM
Buzz and ALL the Think Tankers are sitting at the round table trying to come up with a way to SELL this to us at Pioneer! Why do you think it's taking him sooooooooo Looooooong to respond?

Hmmm ... maybe because I was told to bring my bus back after the a.m. run and they didn't have a fu#king bus to give me ...

Actually, I'm in favor of NOT voting, waiting to see what happens with the EPP ... then voting.

Quote from: John Eadicicco on February 10, 2016, 04:34:06 PM
Buzz let me school you on what I Think. I HAVE negotiated contracts in the real estate industry. I KNOW what it takes to get things to finality. THIS IS A FUCKING EMBARRASSMENT! And to think that there is NOT is tunnel vision on your part. Cordiello negotiated the 5 sicks days OUT of the CBA for 1181. I understand that this web site is a filter for the business of 1181. PLEASE don't insult our INTELLIGENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, as if real estate is in any way related to labor negotiations, why don't you tell us exactly what Michael should have done to get us everything we wanted?

Do you people honestly believe that any union president would purposely present the members with a contract like this ... only to be bashed and hammered ... if there were any possible way he could have done any better? These owners are immovable. They believe they have us over a barrel, their greed and lack of concern for the people who earn them their millions know no bounds. Short of a strike ... and maybe even then ... there is no way they were getting off their high-horses at the bargaining table. After 19 meetings I can't agree that the union didn't make every attempt to squeeze whatever they could out of them.

The reason for the bashing is lack of transparency from 1181. From what I read from Ernie we were getting 3/4 of what we lost back! Elected officials should try N get SOME feedback from the rank and file!

The EPP is a dead issue until one contract negotaited for ALL companies!

Turn off the capital letters, use spell check, and shorten all your posts by 90%.

At least you are not criticizing the content ( short enough) 

... And try hitting the "Enter" key twice to form paragraphs. I'm not even going to try to read it.

(But I'm sure Salerno would have negotiated a contract that would have made us employee-owners of the company.)

Quote from: Buzz on February 10, 2016, 10:26:34 PM

(But I'm sure Salerno would have negotiated a contract that would have made us employee-owners of the company.)

I doubt he would have sold us out like Mike did.

Everybody will vote no, but the fix will be in.  aka:  Mike the Great Negotiator, 2008 remember.  From Buzz's mouth to my ears!!!!!

Quote from: Stugots on February 10, 2016, 11:03:16 PM
Everybody will vote no, but the fix will be in.  aka:  Mike the Great Negotiator, 2008 remember.  From Buzz's mouth to my ears!!!!!

I don't think newer drivers will vote no. I don't think people who can't do without medical coverage will vote no, even though many of them won't actually be in favor of it.

I don't understand your reference to 2008, but how could "Mike" have forced them to give us any more? Tell us.

And ... "the fix" ... just a stupid comment. (Was "the fix" in at Reliant? Not once, but THREE times? Or Atlantic, for that matter.)

Quote from: 4real on February 10, 2016, 04:52:06 PM
Buzz I've officially lost all respect for you and now know for sure you write what you are told to write Michael is all to blame,  he should have taken a page out of the Neil's book and got up and walked out of negotiations before even considering showing this to the members... Come on Buzz who does is to blame

Yes, and that would have gotten us an imposed contract again. He did exactly what he is supposed to do ... take their best offer and present it to us. That is his job, that is his obligation. He does not have the right to decide whether or not we should accept their offer without us even seeing it ... he has to present it to us for ratification ... or not. That is entirely up to us.


p.s...

Quote from: 4real on February 10, 2016, 04:52:06 PM
... and now know for sure you write what you are told to write ...

Right ... and they told me to write that this contract sucks. (That was just an asinine comment.)

In contract negotiations, both parties should feel the outcome  is a win-win situation. Do not present it unless you feel that way.  That is the reason he should not have presented this.   :thumbdown:

Is it a shitty contract? You bet.
Is it the best out there? Who knows but I don't believe it's going to get any better with a No vote.

I for one can't afford to vote NO.I am voting HELL YES.! You see I am not one of the MANY who opted out of our medical which drove the numbers down that someone posted on fb.I need my medical for myself and family. A NO vote takes away my medical and possibly my job. I am doing this way to long to start a new career.

Oh and does everyone know that those that opted out of our medical receive about $3,000.00 a year from the same man they hate. That's right Neil gives a check to all those who opted out. So my answer is this. How dare anyone try to sway anyone's vote to NO that has NO other means of income? The people who do this as a second job, they have money coming in every month ie pension and health benefits. The city takes care of their retires very well. I don't have that luxury. So I say VOTE for what suits your needs. NOT what someone who yells louder or stands up and says fuck this company when they get paid to be out of MY Medical. If you only have this job as your primary income with medical,don't make a mistake that would please the ones who do.

I honestly thought Neil would rise to the occasion and give us a much better contract based on his very profitable contract with the city.  He could of shined like a star, but instead his continuous greed and love for money is much more important to him than his employees.

I saw John Eadicicco's post on Facebook and unfortunately people are afraid to voice their opinions due to the retaliation that Owen and Neil can impose.  I would have to say a 'no' vote is in order for this pathetic contract.

Quote from: Air_Brakes on February 11, 2016, 12:10:57 AM
In contract negotiations, both parties should feel the outcome  is a win-win situation. Do not present it unless you feel that way.  That is the reason he should not have presented this.   :thumbdown:

Actually, it's said a good contract is one in which neither side is happy. I think Neil is happy.

This is a re-post from Ernie's post on Facebook:

From Ernie:
I'm sorry for all the disarray at Arthur Kill yard this morning. What I brought forward to the family at Pioneer is only the truth about our medical. I myself don't have a secondary insurance and its easy for people to kill this contract who are opt outs in our company, Due to having insurance in other places. People asked for the facts and that is exactly what I am giving you there are no ghosts here.

I am absolutely sick and tired of hearing that the union is selling people out. After almost 20 sessions of negotiations this is what we wound up with. Sadly I'm not pleased with the contract either and no one is telling you to vote a specific way You vote the way you want. I did not use this as a scare tactic. I just gave you all the facts. This contract came together by trying to save the medical with the city's helping hand. The owners of the large companies are putting in over $37 million dollars to make this medical plan solvent .

As Deanna said we should have stayed out on the strike line and fought then for what we wanted not now. But we all know we were beginning to divide and people couldn't to stay out without medical. So I would like to know what changed now? And most importantly the people that are speaking out that want to strike now HAVE medical. But for others that have no medical becomes a big burden. It is not scare tactics it is facts and blaming Michael and union is very unfair. This is the hand he was dealt and had to work with what he had.

Just to reiterate that a NO vote is a strike vote. The city said if there is a strike they will pull the money back they gave for the medical. Once again true facts. Is it fair??? Absolutely not! Is it fact? Absolutely it is. So be wise when you vote.

As far as I am concerned as your Shop Steward I cannot look back at what we lost because we put it on the table and they refused to deal with us for the first seven sessions. They stood and walked out of our negotiations .Even having a federal mediator in the room. If you look at the contract. We lost nothing at this time .We have moved forward. I am not discounting what we lost prior to this contract. And yes we all would have loved to get back what he took away under false pretenses I am in the yard if anyone wants to speak to me about this contract. Please see me. I will give you facts and facts only.
Ernie

Its a no no vote for me. A no vote does not mean a strike vote thats bullshit. They should give us 30 days before voting, by then the weather will be better and now we vote no to this fucked up contract and lets see how fast a no vote is a strike vote when we walk out in much warmer weather. For me its a No No vote now or later.

Quote from: worker341 on February 11, 2016, 02:01:26 AM
A no vote does not mean a strike vote thats bullshit.

I would love to find an alternative. What would that be?

(And before you answer consider the fact that Neil told Ernie, in regard to the contract, "If you don't like it, get your strike signs ready.")

worker341
I really don't understand your last post about 30 days and warmer weather. Please explain.

Today I went back to the yard at 8:00am and stayed there until 10:45am. With a combined 500 drivers & matrons at Pioneer SI and considering the importance of going back to the yard and not only asking Ernie questions but at the same time listening to other Members questions and statements I am disappointed in many of my fellow Members. I understand some drivers had trips but at minimum I expected to see 200 members. I'd say in the 2:45 mins I sat there 80 members came back. Out of those 80 members besides myself maybe 10 asked questions or made statements. Even this site today alone there was only 60 posts about the contract but the best part is those 60 posts were repeated posts by just 10 people. My point is whether you are a Michael fan or not, whether you hate Neil or not is how the hell can people complain about anything if they don't show interest? In MY OPINION some Members complain about being in the "dark" but that's a bunch of bull! This morning the sun finally came out but most of those Members who complained about the dark chose to stay in the dark. People have to stop talking behind the scenes and voice what you believe openly and this morning was the perfect and an important time to do it! Shame on you and more importantly unfortunate for you, me & all of our Fellow Members!

Proud member 30 days means warmer weather, much better to strike in warmer weather. And we all can prepare ourselves for a strike. The way I figure it  neil knows its cold out there and most of us are not prepared to go on strike now. thats why we are told a no vote is a strike vote. I don't think he will be so brave with this bullshit contract in better weather cause I think most of us will walk, just my thoughs. Its a no vote for me and I am willing to go on strike for a much better contract. And what I hear alot of people feel the same way. And one more thing I will add if this contract is passed by our members what do you think the next contract will be like.

Don't be misled by strike vote. This was all timed perfectly by the powers that be. Why?
If it is a no vote than we strike immediately according to Ernie and that means you WILL NOT collect unemployment for Presidents week! Nice timing !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am amazed at how some of you love to fantasize about all that your going to do and force Neil into submission and give us whatever we demand.Newsflash!!Take a good look at this MOA because this is what we're getting whether we like it or not.I for one do not like it, but being the realist that I am ,if you think going on strike is going to change this guys mind you are Dreaming!!Just remember where it got us the last time.We didn't get to this point overnight ,so you might as well wake up and face the harsh ugly reality it sucks to be us in this position but that's the way it is.The time to realize what was happening on the horizon concerning our future in this industry has come and gone so you might as well man up and deal with reality and dry your eyes.This guy ain't budging and if you don't believe that I got a bridge to sell you.The time to get tough is long gone,and the FREAKIN' WEATHER AINT GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH ANYTHING!!

Fellow Members
This is my opinion please take it into consideration as I do yours. First of all the idea of striking us striking in cold or warm weather makes no difference to Neil what so ever. Worker341 you state if we sign this contract then what about next contract. That makes no sense the last MOA that we signed we all gave back between $1000 and $8000 depending on your seniority and overtime. Today's MOA we're not giving back anything we're gaining things. It may not be what we want or deserve but it's more than what we have today. For those who are stuck on this idea that we have to get back all of what we gave up because we are owed it ...  Plain English ... Think about what you are saying? We are not children! We were not forced to sign thst last MOA. What man or woman in their right mind no matter what they are told or no matter what is insinuated could possibly think they are going to get back what they willingly signed away? As far as I'm concerned this current contract negotiation is not based on what the last contract was it based on bettering our present contract. I could go on and on. I could also go into specifics but it really doesn't make a difference. So to get to the point no matter if you are a new hire, you are a retired city workers or not, you have 5 years in the Union or you have 40 years in the Union we all have to face reality. And reality is no matter how shitty any of us including myself think this contract is WE ALL HAVE TO VOTE YES!!!! The reason being is very simple. If we don't sign it we will DEFINITELY be outside the gate. And when and IF We go back to work it will be for this same MOA that we didn't sign if not less. Plus we will never recoup the money that we lose while we're on strike. And that's not to mention the Members who NEED the medical. Unfortunately a YES vote is a no-brainer! What's done is done! Whoever is to blame is to blame but what I'm saying is REALITY. If you don't agree with me and it's up to them to respond if they want ask Buzz and ask John Chico. I don't think you could find two guys on this site that are on more opposite ends than them but I'd go out on a limb and say they'd both agree me. God Bless all my Brothers & Sisters!

Proud Member makes some valid points ,,contract is not the greatest by a long shot ,,but in reality we had no give backs,my only fear is the medical for 2017,,that was left open in the funding area and that's  where it scares me ,, now the new members made some great gains and that's where it was needed,if not for new hirees this union will go under and pensions will be drastically reduced or lost.. so  i see what micheal did here,and it makes sense from a union stand point ,but  we could have received the retro from Sept 1, and and least one accrual day back now and the rest in 2018,,but a no vote means strike and nobody wins then,,again just an opinion ,we all have to make the a decision...

Let me see if I got this right.  Instead of giving back to drivers, some who have been here 25, 30, and 35 plus years, money that they gave up so the owner  could be competitive in a bid, but never needed because he got an extension, and now feels its his, he would rather us go on strike, shut down yards in Staten Island and the Bronx, idle 600 plus buses, lose payment from his contract, lose his medical payment from the city, and be fined $500,000 a day.  WOW!!

Since the last strike some contractors have invested in STRIKE INSURANCE , this will cover close to 80% of lost revenue and if you figure in what will be saved in operating costs , why would he not want you to strike , and why would he give you a decent contract, why would he negotiate with the same fool that gave up the whole store to them and then comes back looking for a refund, we have been played big time, remember this next time your Stewart packs you all in the buses to go to a phony  Cordiello vote , it's all on the members once again, you now need to think about a hypothetical scenario, that is not really so hypothetical because it has happened before , you go out on the strike line and since we all have multiple contracts no other 1181 company will strike with you because it's not there contract and will face immediate termination , the BOE pulls Pioneers  work, your company closes it's doors and says goodby to all of you, your GM has plenty of time to replace the membership with all new low paid drivers, re opens under a new name with all his new drivers after he puts a new  bid in on the next round of BOE work and he is golden, hence the tragedy of not having a union wide contract, because anyone can replace a few hundred workers but replacing a whole union is something that won't happen , tell your boy Michael to get us all back under ONE CONTRACT and bring back our combined unified strength he gave away with a wink and a nod to his best friends the CONTRACTORS!!!!,,,, don't matter who you work for we are all in a world of trouble!!

I don't know if Neil has insurance or not with regards to us striking? What I do know is no matter how much it would cost him per day if we were to strike he has enough money to outlast each and every one of us. Him and his family's lifestyle would not change AT ALL where as the majority of our's would change drastically after one week. And I'm just talking financially not even thinking about our Medical.
Just read 24yrs1181's last post.
Now this is a guy who we all know has nothing good to say about Michael at all. And he can correct me if I'm misinterpreting him but I believe what he is saying is vote YES because right now this is the best we're gonna get and don't risk possible losing our jobs. Then afterward at the next election we go in a different direction whether it be Tommy or someone else.
I really thing a YES vote is a no-brainer and there's really no reason to get into specifics because basically there's 3 specifics in the new MOA.
1. Sign it and our Medical is secure.
2. We get a 5% raise over 2 1/2 yrs.
3. 2 weeks before this contract ends all of us that lost accrual days will get back all the days each of us lost.
These are 3 things MORE than we have today plus a YES vote assures us that we have a job for the next 2 1/2 years. For those who don't want to hear "Thank God we have a job" all I can respectively say to you is look at our economy and THANK GOD YOU HAVE A JOB. Believe me there are thousands of men & women that are ready, willing and able to take our 800 positions at Pioneer.

You forgot one!

4. Paid sick days

its a sad day that you might get kicked in the teeth and have to say , thank you, there has been too many good , hard working people that have had to say goodby to this job through no fault of their own , now we have been put into the fire one more time, if we were all under one contract it would be a no brainer to dismiss any insulting contract, but because of the decision our current leadership has elected to stand behind that leaves us unprotected under multiple contracts it would be terrible to see any brother or sister find themselves replaced and not have a job, it might be better to pick this fight when we have stronger leadership.

It will be better to pick this fight when we get an EPP from Albany ... which is very likely this year THANKS TO MICHAEL AND OUR CURRENT EB.

(But even then you won't give him any credit.)

John you hit the nail right on the head with your statement. Just don't understand why the Union can't give us more time to vote. We did wait many months for Neil to give us this bullshit contract, now I think he should wait longer for our votes.

Quote from: worker341 on February 11, 2016, 06:02:38 PM
John you hit the nail right on the head with your statement. Just don't understand why the Union can't give us more time to vote. We did wait many months for Neil to give us this bullshit contract, now I think he should wait longer for our votes.

Ernie said it's because the city wants a contract before they release the money they're giving towards the medical.

Are we really going to start debating on when we should vote? Regardless if the Medical Fund was solvent or not there's nothing in this MOA to decipher that can't be done in 5 minutes let alone 2 days or 2 months. Furthermore as it appears ALL are starting to see a that there is Realistically no other vote than a YES vote. Why prolong the STRESS? Go in tomorrow morning, vote, do your job and then begin to start seriously thinking and doing whatever is needed so that you & I don't have to read & listen to my shit at the end of June 2018!

Oh boy it's always about what benefits the owners... I hope you can sleep at night you little scumbag! I don't know how you can come to work knowing everybody hates you douchebag

Quote from: PROUD MEMBER on February 11, 2016, 07:11:43 PM
Are we really going to start debating on when we should vote? Regardless if the Medical Fund was solvent or not there's nothing in this MOA to decipher that can't be done in 5 minutes let alone 2 days or 2 months. Furthermore as it appears ALL are starting to see a that there is Realistically no other vote than a YES vote. Why prolong the STRESS? Go in tomorrow morning, vote, do your job and then begin to start seriously thinking and doing whatever is needed so that you & I don't have to read & listen to my shit at the end of June 2018!

I've refrained from mentioning this before, but this is at least the 3rd time in recent threads that you've "scolded" people for what they choose to talk about. That's kind of the purpose of an open discussion board ... capeesh?

Buzz
Sometimes u amaze me. Unfortunately I was never blessed to have children of my own. Which means I have NEVER SCOLDED anyone in my life! You do not have a more neutral and respectful member on this site. Every other one of my posts say "This is my opinion" or "I respect everyone's opinion" or "I don't want to argue" or "God Bless my fellow Brothers & Sisters," etc., etc. With regards to my last post I wasn't scolding I was trying to ensure that other Union Members at Pioneer know that it is my opinion to vote YES and to vote NOW not two weeks or two months from now when our Medical will be gone and Neil may withdraw the little bit that he is willing to give. You sincerely hurt me with your comment. I would think by now you know me better than that. Furthermore with the way others talk to each other on this site including yourself you're going to talk negative about me? For 6 weeks up until 3 weeks ago we had a Member (wakeup123) that practically told people to go F themselves and that was OK with you. Lastly I'd assume when 24yrs1181 posts something and you comment back that you're not SCOLDING HIM!

Being the word "scold" was in quotes, that means it should not be taken literally, so please don't. I wasn't saying you shouldn't voice your opinion or can't disagree with others. I was saying you should not define what topic(s) others should or should not be able to discuss.

Quote from: 24yrs1181 on February 11, 2016, 03:40:31 PM
Since the last strike some contractors have invested in STRIKE INSURANCE , this will cover close to 80% of lost revenue.

I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but I've never heard of STRIKE INSURANCE.  If I were an insurance company, the last people I would give strike insurance to would be school buses in NYC considering we were out for a month a short time ago. At 80% return of lost revenue would probably bankrupt the insurance company.

24yrs1181
Why do you allow the shit to flow from your mouth? Why do you care what happens at PIONEER??? you do not work here.So shut the fuk up and stop saying this is going to kick us in the teeth.

I have news for you and your buddies serlano brothers and who ever else is going on the ticket to run.
NO ONE could have done any better than what we are getting now..THERE was nothing else to work with.So stop praising yourself and the rest of MFC..because bottom line.They couldn't have done any better with what Cordiello had to work with!

Why would I not care about people that suffer through the job as I do , I care about all the people at Pioneer , all of them except one jerkoff , hay just-right can you guess who that might be, go ahead ,just look in the mirror !!!

Well I quess I losted I voted no, However the yes votes win this shit contract. From this point on I will not discuss on this site how we got fucked. Like I said before I will no longer bitch about this fucked up contract its here now and I will learn to live with it for now. I hope all you yes voters will learn to live with it too our job will never be the same from this day forward. I will start looking for a real job with real pay and a much better health plan for my Family and yes a better pension for me to. Wish you all good health and good wealth your all going to need it here at Pioneer.

Listen 24yr1181
So you are calling me a jerk off??
Really? You want to run for office yet call a member in good standing a jerk off? Well sweetness here's a heads up for you.
I just printed what you called me and I'm going to show it to everyone I can to let them know that a person running for a seat on OUR EB goes around calling members jerk offs.Let's see how many votes you get.

Oh and by the way I wish I could visit you and hand you an ENGLISH dictionary. that way you'll know how to spell.

HAY is for horses...!!!

And you want to hold an executive position ?? You need to learn how to spell first .Are you at least an American?

List, ???, least ???
English dictionary ???

Really ? do you think the members on this existing executive board are Rocket Scientists ? They definitely cant add but they can sure take away. 24yrs is looking pretty good right now

Quote from: worker341 on February 12, 2016, 08:12:30 PM
and yes a better pension for me to.

Decent pensions are only privy to executive board members.  Not to the people they represent.

Quote from: worker341 on February 12, 2016, 08:12:30 PM
I will start looking for a real job with real pay and a much better health plan for my Family and yes a better pension for me to. Wish you all good health and good wealth your all going to need it here at Pioneer.

Even before this shit storm began, this wasn't a good paying job. As for the health plan, as of now, nothing really changed except for the weekly contributions and higher co-pays. Good luck finding employment with a better health plan.