New Contract Discussion - Part 2

[Buzz]

From Part 1:

I am amazed at how some of you love to fantasize about all that your going to do and force Neil into submission and give us whatever we demand.Newsflash!!Take a good look at this MOA because this is what we're getting whether we like it or not.I for one do not like it, but being the realist that I am ,if you think going on strike is going to change this guys mind you are Dreaming!!Just remember where it got us the last time.We didn't get to this point overnight ,so you might as well wake up and face the harsh ugly reality it sucks to be us in this position but that's the way it is.The time to realize what was happening on the horizon concerning our future in this industry has come and gone so you might as well man up and deal with reality and dry your eyes.This guy ain't budging and if you don't believe that I got a bridge to sell you.The time to get tough is long gone,and the FREAKIN' WEATHER AINT GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH ANYTHING!!

Fellow Members
This is my opinion please take it into consideration as I do yours. First of all the idea of striking us striking in cold or warm weather makes no difference to Neil what so ever. Worker341 you state if we sign this contract then what about next contract. That makes no sense the last MOA that we signed we all gave back between $1000 and $8000 depending on your seniority and overtime. Today's MOA we're not giving back anything we're gaining things. It may not be what we want or deserve but it's more than what we have today. For those who are stuck on this idea that we have to get back all of what we gave up because we are owed it ...  Plain English ... Think about what you are saying? We are not children! We were not forced to sign thst last MOA. What man or woman in their right mind no matter what they are told or no matter what is insinuated could possibly think they are going to get back what they willingly signed away? As far as I'm concerned this current contract negotiation is not based on what the last contract was it based on bettering our present contract. I could go on and on. I could also go into specifics but it really doesn't make a difference. So to get to the point no matter if you are a new hire, you are a retired city workers or not, you have 5 years in the Union or you have 40 years in the Union we all have to face reality. And reality is no matter how shitty any of us including myself think this contract is WE ALL HAVE TO VOTE YES!!!! The reason being is very simple. If we don't sign it we will DEFINITELY be outside the gate. And when and IF We go back to work it will be for this same MOA that we didn't sign if not less. Plus we will never recoup the money that we lose while we're on strike. And that's not to mention the Members who NEED the medical. Unfortunately a YES vote is a no-brainer! What's done is done! Whoever is to blame is to blame but what I'm saying is REALITY. If you don't agree with me and it's up to them to respond if they want ask Buzz and ask John Chico. I don't think you could find two guys on this site that are on more opposite ends than them but I'd go out on a limb and say they'd both agree me. God Bless all my Brothers & Sisters!

LMR and PROUD MEMBER, you are both ... unfortunately ... correct. There is a reason this contract is so pitiful. The reason is that the owners know that ... for the time being at least ... they got us by the balls. These negotiations were less about "getting back" as all of us had hoped, and more about saving our medical coverage, as evidenced by increased contributions by both parties. Despite what some may claim to know, our welfare fund is nearly deplete, with an 8 to 12 day reserve at best. Loss of coverage, as Ernie pointed out in his post, is what caused many to capitulate in the last strike. This may not be an issue for the 89 people who opt out and obviously have other coverage, but for the majority it IS the deciding factor ... and the owners know it. Indeed, for some people, the coverage is the only reason they're here.

There is also good reason to believe that we would probably not have the backing of our mechanics.

Even if we were successful in getting something more back ... and we wouldn't be, they're not going to bend ... would it make up for what we would lose by going on strike? Rarely, if ever, is that the case, and we're dealing with the most greedy, deceitful, and uncaring owners ever. They have a HUGE cushion to fall back on. It won't affect their lives one iota. They played hardball with the city last spring, holding out for their 3 year contract, even though they risked going out of business. They're certainly not going to be brought to their knees by us.

I don't think there is anybody who wouldn't love to say, "Take this contract and stick it up your ASS!!" It's bad enough that we're being fu#ked by "him" ... we have to be careful not to fu#k ourselves on top of it. The contract SUCKS!! It is nothing short of an insult to every 1181 member of this company. But when we vote on it, we have to ask ourselves whether we want to compound that insult with the self-inflicted injury of a strike.

[Eucerin]

When do we vote on this MOA? Can we abstain as a formal vote?

[Buzz]

When do we vote on this MOA? Can we abstain as a formal vote?

We vote tomorrow. You don't have to vote, but I don't think there's a check box for that.

[yabba]

good post buzz...i would have no problem voting yes...my only fear is the 3rd year 50/50 medical...that i feel is going to cost us the 5% raise and much more..  i see contractors paying less into medical per month on family and only a few dollars more on single in the coming years,maybe im reading it wrong but i dont see a fix here for a failed fund...

[Buzz]

I know what you mean and share your concern. Hopefully, by that time the fund will be in much better shape due to increased contributions, and Trump will have undone Obamacare and some normalcy will return to health care coverage costs.

[hognol]

I know what you mean and share your concern. Hopefully, by that time the fund will be in much better shape due to increased contributions, and Trump will have undone Obamacare and some normalcy will return to health care coverage costs.

Trump? Our union is telling us to vote for Hillary as they did Obama.  I'm proud to say I did not vote for Obama and I am certainly not voting for Hillary.

[yabba]

trump is the man   

[worker341]

I respect everybodies opinion on this contract. However I will still be voting no I just can't make myself vote yes. However it turns out I will respect what the members of this Union voted for. It may not be the best union but it is still better then no union at all.

[Manwithabus]

I have a few questions to all of our members who are voting NO.  Do you really think this is a good idea?  What do you think will happen?  Do you think everything will magically turn around and be wonderful for us?  Do you think we'll get everything back that we lost?  Do you really want ANOTHER strike?  What did the first one accomplish? I'm not knocking any of our retired city employees, after all, any of us could have taken that route.  But for a lot of us, THIS is our bread and butter.  We NEED this job, and the benefits afforded to us,  myself included.  We can complain left and right and up and down, and we all know times are tough for everyone, but the bottom line is we will come to work everyday and have a job.  Some posters are sick and tired of hearing that, but it's the truth.  Let's deal with it and move on.  Stay safe everyone, and good luck.

[gigi11744]

  Cannot tell you how to vote that is your personal decision, but here are some numbers that you should be aware of .On a strike lasting 4 weeks for a senior driver
the minimum wage loss after taxes is around  $750.00 per week (that's $3,000.00 for a four week strike) .Now you have to come close to doubling that amount as there will be bills to be paid,this is fact.Now i'm not a gambling man ,and to throw $6,000.00 on thinking that things will change ,not a good bet.. Your choice.. Don't let the bitterness from the last contract,or you dislike of your union president ,cloud your judgement... good luck all

[4real]

we all know this is the contract we are getting regardless how you voted ( i will not believe the outcome unless john Eadicicco is there to witness the counting)we were sold out (AGAIN) by michael I hope the owners payed you well..I for one never voted for you or for any of your contracts... they say the last Regime was corrupt but at least WE ALL ATE...You all can believe what ever you want... GOOD LUCK TO US ALL... AND THANK YOU MICHAEL FOR TAKEN DOWN 1181........

[Just_Right]

Are you kidding me??? Looks around with disgust at how some people around here could even think of some clown speaking out about a union selling them out.Or having a a nobody be an overseer ..please.you people need to learn to COMPREHEND what you read.It's a wonder how you can read street signs,or the name of the children on your stops.

[Buzz]

... ( i will not believe the outcome unless john Eadicicco is there to witness the counting) ...

Ohhhh .... okay ... now your posts make perfect sense.

[4real]

^^^^^^^ this is why we are where we are ^^^^^^^^

[4real]

you people are so ignorant im embarrassed for

[John Eadicicco]

I will not be there when they count the votes. It doesn't matter what the count is. It will pass because" the powers that be" WANT it to pass. If this wasn't the case than 1181 would have given us a fair amount of time to process all 8 pages of the MOA. Also if fair be fair then if it is voted down it should NOT automatically put us out on strike!It should go to an independent arbitrator. But NO....................................... 1181 tells us that there was a mediator present during discussions and the coalition walked out of multiple sit downs! What cracks me up over the shenanigans that they call negotiations are the fact that I was told that, in the future, there will be ONE contract for the entire local just like it used to be! Why NOT NOW? Get the KY jelly out folks! 1181 gave the contractors just what they wanted again and again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[4real]

John they already cashed the check!!!

[4real]

"debating with an idiot is like playing chess with a pigeon--- it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory" You've never been so right Buzz I'm done with this topic.......

[4real]

Be careful what you say big brother is checking profiles. Of those of us speaking out against this joke of a contract!!!

[Buzz]

you people are so ignorant im embarrassed for

Well, at least most of us can write in complete sentences, use the shift key for capitals and include apostrophes (like I'm instead of im).

[4real]

Yea your a Genius....

[LMR]

Hey 4real yup make some strong accusations implying Michael and the EB are on the take and the companies are paying.Also Michael negotiating a sh##t contract.Its one thing to think it and another to put it out there on a site such as this.You also accuse the vote counters to be corrupt and not legitimate.Then you continue your rant against Buzz berating him and call the membership ignorant and you're embarrassed of us.First of all,let me be clear.I'm not advocating for Michael,Buzz or anybody else,there big boys and they can stand up for themselves I'm sure.But when you poke insults toward the membership that includes me.Unless you have clear proof of your accusations you are entitled to your opinion but you do not have the right to put it out of sites such as this  You show your immaturity and you definitely do not know how to conduct yourself as a union brother.If you're that dissatisfied with the union you are in ,turn in your  card and your membership and take your gage age somewhere else. ERNIE posted on this site that he would be available to answer any questions.I don't remember hearing any of your concerns the.Bring your facts if you are going to make strong and serious accusations before you run you're mouth

[Just_Right]

Hmmmm...looks to me that *the powers to be* ie (the loyal and honorable union members) have spoken. I didn't see any wrong doing by Michael or anyone else.

[Stugots]

4 real, you are absolutely right.  It just goes to show how weak we are, when the Executive Board and the President are so incompetent that they negotiate a shit contract like this.  At least they made a stand in Queens.  Id like to know what the count was.  That will be interesting, if we can even believe what they say.  This contract was shoved down out throats and we buckled.  It's over  It will never be the same.